Approved but....

Dec 5, 2018

  1. LGilmore
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    LGilmore Guru

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    You know, this is why they tell you to keep selling. As you continue to post, I start to sense that even if she takes the policy, it will lapse.

    Something about the transaction is making me think she knew she had an issue and you didn't. She didn't disclose and you're left holding the bag.

    If you don't hear from her, just slow drip communications and keep a record of your contacts. I don't think you're going to place this one or it will stay on the books. Sorry
     
  2. DHK
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    DHK "YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"

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    My take was that you were trying to take a difficult situation for a novice... and make it WORSE by suggesting that someone contact their E&O provider.

    Rick may have been abrasive with you, but he's generally not wrong.

    E&O is there for Errors and Omissions in the selling of our product. It does not apply to fraud (not applicable here) and it does not apply to difficult clients. It's a type of "Malpractice insurance" for the INADVERTENT error - something that got overlooked.


    I remember in my first couple of months in this business where I was an assistant to a financial advisor at a credit union... and a client called. She asked about money that was missing from her variable annuity. While I had client management experience, I was still new to the insurance and securities industry. I actually said "I don't know how to handle this. I suppose there is arbitration...?" (That was dumb, but I was dumber than a box of rocks back then.)

    No, we didn't go to arbitration. What we later found out... was that a cashier's check was sent to the insurance company... but it was never cashed. It was the insurance company's fault - not ours. So, we got another check issued and credited to her variable annuity INCLUDING lost returns that she would've had... and we had another sale. We got the external wholesaler involved as well as the internal help desk to ensure that we were okay and so was the client.

    You don't suggest arbitration or contacting your E&O when you don't have all the facts of the situation yet. There was no fraud. And there was no error or omission on the part of the advisor.

    So I'll state it again: Rick may have been abrasive with you, but he's generally not wrong.

    Oh, let me add this extremely important point: A license is NOT just "a license to sell". A license is a license to hold you accountable and liable for your actions, recommendations, and conduct. It certainly isn't about competence. It's about holding you accountable and liable.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2018
    DHK, Dec 6, 2018
    #22
  3. Life Hawk
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    Which is why I am beginning to believe that even issued at the original premium this was a dud all along...

    Move along... NEXT! :yes:
     
  4. Willie2358
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    Willie2358 Expert

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    Lol. Thanks guys, I think the original premium she would have went for she even provided me a check for both at time of quote. I did however advise her that it's a matter of getting her approved. She herself was declined for a policy on health and build alone. Her husband's policy was approved but he was rated at standard tobacco so it's a little elevated had the smoking not been a factor I'm sure it would have been lower as health and build are relatively ideal in his case. When I reported to her that she was declined and her husband accepted I tried to sell it in the fact that while she was not able to get coverage at this time that she was in fact the beneficiary of the policy and would be protected. It was at that time she stated that her bank account situation would need to be fixed so call her this week. 4 calls and 2 texts later still nothing. So unfortunately for me seems like the relatively easy situation has become complex. I don't think it's a lack of value that was presented though I guess it could be if 65 dollars a month is enough to cause pause. And I'm more comfortable with not placing people in a situation where having a policy will put them in a hard ship. I had a plus 400 risk come back approved for $739 a month lol and while I wanted to issue it I knew damn we
     
  5. Tahoe Ray
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    Tahoe Ray Guru

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    I'm weaker than Winoblues in my sales process so I do mention the alternate strategies up front.

    It goes like this:

    After the whole excited "we have an approval" conversation, which takes place prior to a discussion about price (multiple calls), I reach back out and offer a couple of options (and this assumes that I've shopped the case and we are very close to best offer, which I also mention).

    They want coverage and have a premium in mind so I offer 3 options:

    1: pay the full freight and get what you originally wanted.

    2: pay the original premium and adjust the face accordingly.

    3: meet in the middle. Pay a little more, get a little less death benefit.

    Guess which one most people pick...
     
  6. LGilmore
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    LGilmore Guru

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    Willie, time to let it go. You might want to review your underwriting guidelines next applicant. There is a reason she gave you a check so quickly, I think you made a promise a insurance company would not keep. It sounds like you quoted something that was too good to be true and she jumped on it. Now, as the underwriting comes out, you were waaaay off.

    She's a decline, nothing to place there. He was standard tobacco? You didn't know this with your pre-underwriting? You do understand that insurance companies do have underwriting guidelines and you're supposed to field underwrite, yes?

    Unfortunately as you disclose more and more, it falls back on you not doing your job all that well. You may have promised something you couldn't deliver. That turns into a lot of work for nothing.
     
  7. VolAgent
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    VolAgent Guru

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    There's your problem...

    She got declined, it gets very hard to place the spouse in those situations, especially when it comes back other than applied for. You really should have been in front of them and not tell them over the phone. People get very irrational in these situations. "You mean you'll take my husband but not me? No thanks, we're a pair." And then his was higher too boot?

    As Larry said, you really need to review your underwriting guide more. Also your language comes across as trying to blame others. I think you need to accept you may not have field underwritten this as well as you could have. Unless her build on the exam was vastly different than what she told you, you should have known she would be declined or highly rated.
     
  8. Willie2358
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    Willie2358 Expert

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    I checked the guidelines and went with the least restrictive option I had for them both. What I quoted was what the field tool gave me given the information provided. And he was quoted according to the quote tool. I rated him for his tobacco usage so. And I figured her application would be declined due to her health history and weight build, it's not on me to decide so I submitted an application for her. I advised her that it all depended on the underwriting. In no point was I misleading. The question was if I should confirm the draft date before or after hearing from her as I am not the type of person to just push stuff through only for it to be cancelled. I'm looking for quality issued that will not charge back.
     
  9. Willie2358
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    Willie2358 Expert

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    I think you guys are misunderstanding the situation here. And yes she was a little hurt I would say that she was declined. But my thinking in the process was it was better to get them some protection than nothing at all. Not sure where I blamed others for this issue. I was just asking for opinions on how one would handle her "unavailability" after learning that it was approved other than issued, after telling me to call her back in a week so she can get her bank account figured out. But again because I'm not just chasing premium it does matter to me how she feels about her premium and if its something that will work for them. It's a little higher its non medical issue as they both stated they dont have time or want to submit to medical underwriting.
     
  10. VolAgent
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    VolAgent Guru

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    Yes, it is better to have protection, but they don't always see it that way.

    And by blaming others, I am referring to where you discussed their health and the rating they got. It really came across like you are blaming the company versus accepting you may not have read the underwriting guide as well as you should have.
     
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