Are We the “No Vacation” Nation?

[rousemark]

If I had been asked this question early on in my career, I would have answered completely different. I took little to no vacation. And when I did, all I thought about was how much it was costing me and I wasn't making any money while I was on vacation.

I may be lazy now, but I certainly wasn't in the beginning. And I'm definitely not during AEP. I think I've earned my "laziness".

Understand where you are coming from but am still surprised at the poll results.. Would have thought most agent didn't take anywhere year 20 days per year. In addition to the insurance business, I also minister to a church.. I "officially" get two weeks per year for vacation. Last year is the first time in the 8 years I have been there that I took both weeks.. Normally just take one week.

 

[Bevo]

I personally think there are major trends in how people are viewing "work" over the last few years, and I think they'll continue. The poll must have included a good part of corporate America and not necessarily as many entrepreneurs.

Rather than put your head down for 30+ years and work your tail off at a job you don't particularly like (or maybe you do) with very little time off, many people are realizing that you can structure a business and life to be able to still take a great deal of time off and do whatever they wish, but still be successful. Unless you enjoy working with very little time off, which is fine if that's the case.

And most people who want to retire early are those who haven't found something they enjoy doing enough so they just want it to end. So they work at it harder so it can end quicker, and THEN they'll start doing the things they want to do in life.

A quote that I absolutely love is "Instead of working like crazy to get to the point on the calendar where you get your two weeks off, try designing a life that you don't have to run away from."

 

[sman]

Understand where you are coming from but am still surprised at the poll results.. Would have thought most agent didn't take anywhere year 20 days per year. In addition to the insurance business, I also minister to a church.. I "officially" get two weeks per year for vacation. Last year is the first time in the 8 years I have been there that I took both weeks.. Normally just take one week.

The mentality in this country has been work hard and don't take too much time off. My mother works for a concrete company. The former owner was one of the most generous people I've ever met (more on that in a minute). But he would not let people take two weeks off consecutively. His statement was "if I can do without you for two weeks, I can do without you". That's kind of the mindset in this country. Add to that the fact that most people are living paycheck to paycheck and they just don't have money to go on vacation.

Now back to how generous the former owner was. There were always little things he'd do for people. But when he sold the company he threw a party for all the employees. At this party he gave each employee $1,000 for each year of service they had with the company (he gave away $2 million that night). The next day he threw a small party at his house and invited about 20 select employees (my mother being one of those). he and his wife gave each of those employees $12,000 each. My mother had been there 12 years at the time so she got an extra $36,000 that weekend. While this was a grand gesture of kindness, there are hundreds, maybe thousands of stories about he and his family doing things for people. But, as I mentioned earlier, you weren't taking two consecutive weeks off while working for him. And that is what we see played out throughout this country.

I'm of the same mindset as Bevo. I want to enjoy life now, while I'm young and healthy. I don't want to keep my nose to the grindstone for 30-40 years and THEN try and enjoy myself when I'm old and maybe not as healthy.

 

[Bevo]

But, as I mentioned earlier, you weren't taking two consecutive weeks off while working for him. And that is what we see played out throughout this country.

I

This is precisely the problem and why turnover is so high in many businesses. Business owners and managers are smart enough to realize that people (their greatest assets in their companies) are motivated by entirely different things, and money isn't always the primary.

My friend owns a med supp agency. They have about 18 agents. I think they lost 12 last year alone. This happened because they have the same attitude as your Mom's boss.

Most of it comes down to fear though. Most people were likely afraid to leave your Mom's company. Anyone who chooses to stay in an environment like that, especially after being told "If I can do without you for two weeks, I can do without you", relinquishes all rights to complain about not getting time off.

 

[scagnt83]

What is great about this career is that we can design out schedule to fit the life that we want.

Most "vacation" days I still check on my business for at least 30min, & sometimes even for an hour or two if phone calls or detailed emails are needed and urgent. But after thats done my toes are in the sand for the rest of the day.

But I also take at least 4-5 days in a row each year where I for the most part completely check out from work. I might check voicemails and emails once during the whole trip.


But I agree that the work mindset is changing. Especially in the white collar world. I know of a lot of businesses that let employees take time off as needed as long as they are completing the work by their deadlines. Obviously they cant abuse the policy, but most dont from what owners have told me.


Now what would be really interesting is a honest poll of how many hours insurance agents on the forum are actually working each week along with how long they have been in the biz and how much they are pulling in each year.

----------

This is precisely the problem and why turnover is so high in many businesses. Business owners and managers are smart enough to realize that people (their greatest assets in their companies) are motivated by entirely different things, and money isn't always the primary.

My friend owns a med supp agency. They have about 18 agents. I think they lost 12 last year alone. This happened because they have the same attitude as your Mom's boss.

Most of it comes down to fear though. Most people were likely afraid to leave your Mom's company. Anyone who chooses to stay in an environment like that, especially after being told "If I can do without you for two weeks, I can do without you", relinquishes all rights to complain about not getting time off.

2 weeks in a row is a bit extreme if you work for someone else. Especially a small locally owned business. If it is a large corporation that has plenty of other staff to cover your job then sure. But the cold hard truth is that the average locally owned small business cant afford to have an employee gone for that long of a time.

And he is right, if an employee being away from a small business for 2 weeks has no negative affect on the business then that employee is most likely not needed.

I have a client that gives employees 2 weeks paid vacation and 2 weeks unpaid vacation. But his 1 rule is that you only get 5 days off in a row (excluding normal work holidays) once per year. The rest of the vacation time can only be for 3 days at a time. Of course if you include the weekend that means you could have a 5 day vacation. And of course he would make exceptions as needed for special circumstances.


I agree that employees these days need to grow a set of balls and not be afraid to cross the street for a better opportunity. But at the same time there are lots of people that could care less about doing a decent job... and they wonder why they never advance in life. Statistically the top 5% in this nation work longer hours, watch less tv, read more, & work out more regularly. They also are more likely to enjoy their career despite working longer hours.

 

[Bevo]

And he is right, if an employee being away from a small business for 2 weeks has no negative affect on the business then that employee is most likely not needed.

Well you're only proving my point. IMO, if one of his employees is away for 2 weeks and it impacts his business negatively, then I say he should really take a good hard look at his business. He may give good cash bonuses (but only to a select few as Sman posted) but likely everyone resents him behind his back. Oh but wait, he's a businessman and it's "just business", right? Sure, again, if all you care about it the bottom line. And with people, it's never just business. Which is the same very reason why so many small businesses you speak of fail.

And if your goal in business is to simply get by, and not be hugely successful one day, then you'll always have that problem. Because if you're just getting by, then the people who work for you will really be struggling. This isn't a people problem at this point, it's a business problem. The fact is, the problems you speak of with small business are usually the result of cases where people should have never tried to expand their business and hire others in the first place.

My philosophy is, why not have it all? Top sales, tons of profit, the best people, AND give everyone a sense of ownership, pride, and opportunity. No you can't do this when you're just starting out, but you can certainly strive to eventually set it up that way. Will you make less money? Maybe. Find the right people and treat them well and you'll probably make more though. And believe me life is sure as hell a lot more enjoyable at that point.

Then again I'm not the norm. I hire the best agents, knowing full well that "the best" aren't going to stick around and make me a ton of money unless I treat them extremely well. Hell I never did with any job. This includes monetary compensation and a mutual respect. Some douchebag telling people if they want two weeks off then they're not needed is hardly respectful. In return my agents bring top results, knowing I have very high expectations. They are in the top 5%. But if one asked me for two weeks off or even a month off I'd give it to them in a heartbeat.

Again, I understand we're not the norm. But it works spectacularly, everyone loves their jobs and their lives, and let's just say being in the top 5% pays pretty damn well too.

But that's just how I run my business.

 

[Brian Anderson]

Now what would be really interesting is a honest poll of how many hours insurance agents on the forum are actually working each week along with how long they have been in the biz and how much they are pulling in each year.

That's a good idea - I'll post another poll before long about how many hours agents on the forum are REALLY working each week. Not sure people will be too forthcoming about what they are really pulling in each year though...

________

Thanks for all the insight in the posts so far. And glad to see that many forum members are not afraid to take some decent time off.

 

[smokin goose]

Well you're only proving my point. IMO, if one of his employees is away for 2 weeks and it impacts his business negatively, then I say he should really take a good hard look at his business. He may give good cash bonuses (but only to a select few as Sman posted) but likely everyone resents him behind his back. Oh but wait, he's a businessman and it's "just business", right? Sure, again, if all you care about it the bottom line. And with people, it's never just business. Which is the same very reason why so many small businesses you speak of fail. And if your goal in business is to simply get by, and not be hugely successful one day, then you'll always have that problem. Because if you're just getting by, then the people who work for you will really be struggling. This isn't a people problem at this point, it's a business problem. The fact is, the problems you speak of with small business are usually the result of cases where people should have never tried to expand their business and hire others in the first place. My philosophy is, why not have it all? Top sales, tons of profit, the best people, AND give everyone a sense of ownership, pride, and opportunity. No you can't do this when you're just starting out, but you can certainly strive to eventually set it up that way. Will you make less money? Maybe. Find the right people and treat them well and you'll probably make more though. And believe me life is sure as hell a lot more enjoyable at that point. Then again I'm not the norm. I hire the best agents, knowing full well that "the best" aren't going to stick around and make me a ton of money unless I treat them extremely well. Hell I never did with any job. This includes monetary compensation and a mutual respect. Some douchebag telling people if they want two weeks off then they're not needed is hardly respectful. In return my agents bring top results, knowing I have very high expectations. They are in the top 5%. But if one asked me for two weeks off or even a month off I'd give it to them in a heartbeat. Again, I understand we're not the norm. But it works spectacularly, everyone loves their jobs and their lives, and let's just say being in the top 5% pays pretty damn well too. But that's just how I run my business.

Amen brother!!!!!! .

 

[scagnt83]

Well you're only proving my point. IMO, if one of his employees is away for 2 weeks and it impacts his business negatively, then I say he should really take a good hard look at his business. He may give good cash bonuses (but only to a select few as Sman posted) but likely everyone resents him behind his back. Oh but wait, he's a businessman and it's "just business", right? Sure, again, if all you care about it the bottom line. And with people, it's never just business. Which is the same very reason why so many small businesses you speak of fail.

Of course having the responsibility of providing a secure job for another person requires more than just business. You have to be human and treat people with respect. And I agree that can be a problem with some companies. Before I got into insurance I worked at places like that.

I would not consider the example that I cited as an unfair vacation policy at all. Very few small businesses give employees paid vacation, much less 2 weeks of it. And very few allow for a whole month of vacation (plus holidays) every year.

But in the real world not every business is able to operate on an "ideal" basis. And to compare an insurance agency to a normal business is not a fair comparison. The recurring point in this thread is that us agents are able to have a much more flexible schedule vs. a normal business. Normal businesses are not able to have the same flexibility generally speaking. However, vacation policies at large corporations are starting to become more liberal. Same at small businesses to a lesser extent.

The vacation policy of the client I mentioned is more generous than probably 95%+ of small businesses in this area. Of course to an insurance agent that policy seems like prison!! Like I said before, thats the great thing about this career.
I know a DI wholesaler who has been an agent for over 35 years. She tried going back to the corporate world once and said it was the most miserable year of her life. She said that once your an insurance agent you are ruined for normal jobs... lol.

 

[sman]

Well you're only proving my point. IMO, if one of his employees is away for 2 weeks and it impacts his business negatively, then I say he should really take a good hard look at his business. He may give good cash bonuses (but only to a select few as Sman posted) but likely everyone resents him behind his back. Oh but wait, he's a businessman and it's "just business", right? Sure, again, if all you care about it the bottom line. And with people, it's never just business. Which is the same very reason why so many small businesses you speak of fail.

I assure you his employees didn't resent him. He was a very kind and generous person. Very well liked in the community. He paid his employees well and was always helping those in need (speaking of his employees here). He was just of the old school mindset as far as taking time off. And he would certainly allow someone two weeks in a row if it was really needed.

Some douchebag telling people if they want two weeks off then they're not needed is hardly respectful.

Not sure if that was meant as a commentary on my mother's former boss, but if it is, douchebag is the farthest thing from the truth about this guy. How many douchebags have an employee going through a divorce whose ex-wife ran up thousands of debt on his credit cards right at the end which prevented him from qualifying for a loan to purchase a new home, pulls out their checkbook and writes a check to the employee for the full price of the house and tells the employee to just pay him back once he gets the credit card situation resolved and can refinance the house?