Charlotte BBB Warning About a FE Mailer

[Gooner]

Calling a 100 year old product "new" is not semantics. It is misleading. Calling decades old insurance law "new" is not semantics. It is misleading.

Again...every business in the world has misleading advertising. You sell IUL's which I think are absolute Dog Crap...I would never recommend that type of product to someone. There are much better ways to 'invest' money, but your 'assumption' on your 'projections' make you feel better about selling them??? Give me a freaking break.

Hell SIWL, is the butt ugliest product imaginable, but it serves a purpose. Better yet, it serves an underserved market. Buy here/pay here lots are notorious rip off rackets...yet they serve a purpose...pawn shops...serve a purpose. Mall jewelry stores...serve a purpose. $50 a bucket Popcorn stores serve a purpose. $300/week preschools serve a purpose. $3,000 a gig wedding dj's serve a purpose.

Who are you to sit on your ivory throne casting judgement?

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Anyone who works with clients on a daily basis knows good and well that the general public is not financially literate. Even "educated" people with college degrees or even master degrees know very little as a whole. If 99% of your prospects know what it is for then that is great to hear. But the very fact that new FE agents are making posts about the consumer not realizing they are visiting to talk about life insurance shows that your experience is not the same as others. And most anyone who does not have a financial stake in sending out that type of lead card would look at them and say they are misleading. FE agents who use them can try to justify it all they want to make themselves feel better. Not one single excuse listed in this thread justifies using misleading marketing practices... the only one that even comes close is PCB's comment about putting them in a better financial position... but again, the end does not justify the means.

I start EVERY presentation with 'why did you send this card in'? 70% say they don't have life insurance, 20% have insurance but are shopping, 5-8% say they want more AND 1-2% say they don't know why they sent it in.

Those numbers tell the story...most seasoned Fe agents will probably report the same numbers. Your post stems from your ignorance of the market of which you are speaking, but that's ok...you've proven time and time again you are fully capable of being ignorant.

 

[scagnt83]

Wait just a minute...aren't you one of the guys on here that believes life insurance is a good investment. How would you make money from an IRA?

Not going to get into a debate about the 'investment' potential of life insurance with you guys again...just saying. You preach from your vantage point...I just make sales

First, what does that have to do with the relevance of the statement? Is it ok to mislead people into contributing to an IRA??


I believe that life insurance can be an appropriate long term savings vehicle when used as a portion of ones overall portfolio of savings/investments.... but only if it is overfunded up to the MEC limit.

I do not recommend it as the ONLY investment that a person has... or the first investment that they make. When I recommend it to a client it is usually because they are already maxing out a 401k and IRAs.


And not that it makes my comparison any more or less relevant, but I make money on IRAs because I sell annuities... so I am very familiar with IRAs. I made about an equal amount of money from annuities last year as I did life insurance... if not more.

 

[WinoBlues]

Again...every business in the world has misleading advertising. You sell IUL's which I think are absolute Dog Crap...I would never recommend that type of product to someone. There are much better ways to 'invest' money, but your 'assumption' on your 'projections' make you feel better about selling them??? Give me a freaking break.

Hell SIWL, is the butt ugliest product imaginable, but it serves a purpose. Better yet, it serves an underserved market. Buy here/pay here lots are notorious rip off rackets...yet they serve a purpose...pawn shops...serve a purpose. Mall jewelry stores...serve a purpose. $50 a bucket Popcorn stores serve a purpose. $300/week preschools serve a purpose. $3,000 a gig wedding dj's serve a purpose.

Who are you to sit on your ivory throne casting judgement?

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I start EVERY presentation with 'why did you send this card in'? 70% say they don't have life insurance, 20% have insurance but are shopping, 5-8% say they want more AND 1-2% say they don't know why they sent it in.

Those numbers tell the story...most seasoned Fe agents will probably report the same numbers. Your post stems from your ignorance of the market of which you are speaking, but that's ok...you've proven time and time again you are fully capable of being ignorant.

$3,000.00 for the Chicken Dance and YMCA? Git otta hear!

 

[smokin goose]

"Our special word for today, boys and girls, is bigot. Can you say bigot, boys and girls? I knew you could."

~ Mister Robinson

 

[scagnt83]

Again...every business in the world has misleading advertising. You sell IUL's which I think are absolute Dog Crap...I would never recommend that type of product to someone. There are much better ways to 'invest' money, but your 'assumption' on your 'projections' make you feel better about selling them??? Give me a freaking break.

Hell SIWL, is the butt ugliest product imaginable, but it serves a purpose. Better yet, it serves an underserved market. Buy here/pay here lots are notorious rip off rackets...yet they serve a purpose...pawn shops...serve a purpose. Mall jewelry stores...serve a purpose. $50 a bucket Popcorn stores serve a purpose. $300/week preschools serve a purpose. $3,000 a gig wedding dj's serve a purpose.

Who are you to sit on your ivory throne casting judgement?

$50 buckets of popcorn do not mislead. Someone walks into a popcorn store and they know they are walking into a popcorn store.

I could care less if you think IUL is dog crap. You seem to think thats all I sell... most years I make more money from GUL than I do IUL.

And you have proven time and time again that you are completely ignorant when it comes to any product other than FE. So your opinion of me or the products I sell is dog crap in my opinion.


FE agents who use misleading marketing tactics like the OP posted are no better than payday lenders. You pray on the poor and undeducated.

90% of them would be much better off with a funeral pre-pay policy than a piece of sh*t FE policy.

And for the record, I sell SI WL... but only to people who are uninsurable otherwise and can afford the inflated premiums and need funds beyond something just to bury them.

As a long time poster said to me earlier today in a PM, FE agents who mislead and prey upon the poorest of the poor just add to the "poor tax".



What is ironic is that JD took such offence to my post... while I might not agree with his marketing methods, I actually think he is one of the best and probably most ethical at the point of sale among the FE agents on this forum. And he clearly provides good servicing of his clients, he is not a turn and burn type of agent (which is not limited to FE by any means).

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I start EVERY presentation with 'why did you send this card in'? 70% say they don't have life insurance, 20% have insurance but are shopping, 5-8% say they want more AND 1-2% say they don't know why they sent it in.

Those numbers tell the story...most seasoned Fe agents will probably report the same numbers. Your post stems from your ignorance of the market of which you are speaking, but that's ok...you've proven time and time again you are fully capable of being ignorant.

Again, if those are your stats then great. I have been part of this forum long enough to see many new FE agents ask how the vets handle people who have no clue the lead card was about life insurance.

Question for you Gooner, do you use the type of lead card that the OP posted? Did you look at the link? Do your mailers give the impression they are from a government agency?


And again, you have proven time and time again that you are completely ignorant about life insurance with the exception of FE products.

 

[Gooner]

First, what does that have to do with the relevance of the statement? Is it ok to mislead people into contributing to an IRA?? I believe that life insurance can be an appropriate long term savings vehicle when used as a portion of ones overall portfolio of savings/investments.... but only if it is overfunded up to the MEC limit. I do not recommend it as the ONLY investment that a person has... or the first investment that they make. When I recommend it to a client it is usually because they are already maxing out a 401k and IRAs. And not that it makes my comparison any more or less relevant, but I make money on IRAs because I sell annuities... so I am very familiar with IRAs. I made about an equal amount of money from annuities last year as I did life insurance... if not more.

The relevance to the statement is that you sell IUL's and annuities..there anew plenty of financial people that would call what you do a ripoff..me being one of them. Annuities are for the biggest suckers imaginable, but hey you sleep week at night so that's all that matters.

What I'm saying is that it is all about perspective...I think your a blood suckers and you feel the same way about me...it's all good. I'm not mad and calling into question your ethics/arrogance/ignorance...whatever floats your boat...or lines your pocket.

So to pre-answer your question. NO, I don't sell annuities and NO I don't sell IULs. I won't sell them..period. I think they are rip offs.

 

[scagnt83]

"Our special word for today, boys and girls, is bigot. Can you say bigot, boys and girls? I knew you could."

~ Mister Robinson

When it comes to misleading marketing, yes, I am bigoted. Proud to be.

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The relevance to the statement is that you sell IUL's and annuities..there anew plenty of financial people that would call what you do a ripoff..me being one of them. Annuities are for the biggest suckers imaginable, but hey you sleep week at night so that's all that matters.

What I'm saying is that it is all about perspective...I think your a blood suckers and you feel the same way about me...it's all good. I'm not mad and calling into question your ethics/arrogance/ignorance...whatever floats your boat...or lines your pocket.

So to pre-answer your question. NO, I don't sell annuities and NO I don't sell IULs. I won't sell them..period. I think they are rip offs.

The difference is that I never questioned your product. I questioned your marketing.

And you dont know enough about the products I sell to have an educated opinion about them. You have proven that time and time again.

I know your product inside and out.... and I know the ETHICAL way to sell it.

My marketing practices have not received cease and desist letters from Attorney Generals. My marketing practices are not under investigation by 20 different state regulators.

 

[Gooner]

$50 buckets of popcorn do not mislead. Someone walks into a popcorn store and they know they are walking into a popcorn store. I could care less if you think IUL is dog crap. You seem to think thats all I sell... most years I make more money from GUL than I do IUL. And you have proven time and time again that you are completely ignorant when it comes to any product other than FE. So your opinion of me or the products I sell is dog crap in my opinion. FE agents who use misleading marketing tactics like the OP posted are no better than payday lenders. You pray on the poor and undeducated. 90% of them would be much better off with a funeral pre-pay policy than a piece of sh*t FE policy. And for the record, I sell SI WL... but only to people who are uninsurable otherwise and can afford the inflated premiums and need funds beyond something just to bury them. As a long time poster said to me earlier today in a PM, FE agents who mislead and prey upon the poorest of the poor just add to the "poor tax". What is ironic is that JD took such offence to my post... while I might not agree with his marketing methods, I actually think he is one of the best and probably most ethical at the point of sale among the FE agents on this forum. And he clearly provides good servicing of his clients, he is not a turn and burn type of agent (which is not limited to FE by any means). ---------- Again, if those are your stats then great. I have been part of this forum long enough to see many new FE agents ask how the vets handle people who have no clue the lead card was about life insurance. Question for you Gooner, do you use the type of lead card that the OP posted? Did you look at the link? Do your mailers give the impression they are from a government agency? And again, you have proven time and time again that you are completely ignorant about life insurance with the exception of FE products.

I'm not ignorant about life insurance products, but thanks for your assessment of my intelligence.

But again, you can sit on you ivory tower and throw all the stones you want.

And yes I've used mailers very similar to the OP. I don't post much in here or in the Life forum because of the likes of you. If anyone offers a contrary opinion they are immediately hit with the same response you just gave me...'I'm ignorant'

I post solely in the FE forum because it's my wheelhouse and what I do. My opinions are best offered there. Sure I could post in the commercial/P&C forum about the 15 doctors offices I locked up last quarter or the couple preschools I did. But that is auxiliary to my main focus, even though I made a killing on those deals...not to mention the buy/sells I set up etc...

But you're right...I'm ignorant. I also gave them my CPA and investment guys numbers so they could get REAL advice on investing.

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When it comes to misleading marketing, yes, I am bigoted. Proud to be. ---------- The difference is that I never questioned your product. I questioned your marketing. And you dont know enough about the products I sell to have an educated opinion about them. You have proven that time and time again. I know your product inside and out.... and I know the ETHICAL way to sell it. My marketing practices have not received cease and desist letters from Attorney Generals. My marketing practices are not under investigation by 20 different state regulators.

I've never received a cease and desist...nor been informed of one from any of my vendors. I'm as ethical as the day is long. I don't need to make a buck off of people...I enjoy what I do.

 

[scagnt83]

I'm not ignorant about life insurance products, but thanks for your assessment of my intelligence.

........

I don't post much in here or in the Life forum because of the likes of you. If anyone offers a contrary opinion they are immediately hit with the same response you just gave me...'I'm ignorant'

When you make statements that are factually untrue that means you are not fully educated on the subject.

Gooner, you have made untrue statements about how par WL works. You have made untrue statements about how UL works. Untrue statements about IUL, about Fixed Annuities, about Indexed Annuities.

I have learned A LOT from this forum over the years. I always believe there is something to learn no matter how much you already know. But you always think you already have all the answers. When you post in other sections it is usually to tell someone how much of a "rip off" that product is... then you make a bunch of statements about it that only prove you are clueless about the product you claim to be a "rip off".

The only time I call someone ignorant is if they refuse to look at the facts in an objective manner.
You gave me your stats and experience using lead cards like that. I did not question it. In fact, I said that is a great thing. But over the past 5 years I have seen a whole lot of posts from agents using those types of cards who have had the exact opposite experience.

And do you think Im impressed that you sell some term insurance to fund a buy/sell? It is a less complicated product than FE.

Now I had no clue that you did P&C... just like you probably have no clue that I do 401k plans. You think all I do is IUL because that is almost all you and I have interacted about. That is just a small part of what I do.


Do you use mailers that look like they came from the government to get your dentist clients?..... I already know the answer to that... so why not? Do you think they would consider it a misleading marketing practice if you did? Do you think any would respond if you did?

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I've never received a cease and desist...nor been informed of one from any of my vendors. I'm as ethical as the day is long. I don't need to make a buck off of people...I enjoy what I do.

If you have used the National Processing Center, or the American Senior Alliance, then your lead vendor has received a cease and desist.

Do you think that a lead vendor would actually tell agents that a regulator sent them a cease and desist? Or that they are under investigation for misleading marketing practices?

 

[Gooner]

Gooner, you have made untrue statements about how par WL works. You have made untrue statements about how UL works. Untrue statements about IUL, about Fixed Annuities, about Indexed Annuities.

Find the post where I've talked about par WL, fixed and indexed annuities in depth...I haven't. I do however believe they are not in the best interest of the consumer...but again...I don't count on them for my income, so of course I'm not biased towards them.

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Do you think that a lead vendor would actually tell agents that a regulator sent them a cease and desist? Or that they are under investigation for misleading marketing practices?

Yes, the lead vendors I use would. They would immediately move me to a different type of lead, but that is because I deal with ethical people.

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when you post in other sections it is usually to tell someone how much of a "rip off" that product is...

now you're showing your true colors. I've made comments maybe twice along these lines. Both times were in jest and got way out of hand ---------- find the post where i've talked about par wl, fixed and indexed annuities in depth...i haven't. I do however believe they are not in the best interest of the consumer...but again...i don't count on them for my income, so of course i'm not biased towards them. ---------- yes, the lead vendors i use would. They would immediately move me to a different type of lead, but that is because i deal with ethical people.

. .

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Post made between 11pm and 3 am are automatically not counted because I was probably heavily intoxicated...although that's not the case today