Do You Think All of the Off Exchange People

[bill3173]

are going to continue to pay these increases? I for one am sick of it. I hate paying that artificially high premium.

At some point, it's not worth it, if you don't have any systemic illness and carry DI and CI at a decent level..I'm going to be at that point very soon.

 

[STIBROKER]

At some point, it's not worth it,

BUT you get a commission on your policy.......

 

[Yagents]

I've run the numbers already, and the only way to make it work is to compare the following and do an HSA:

1. Can you tax deduct your premiums as self employed (I can)
2. Buy 6k HDHP and fully fund your HSA account $6650 (I do)
3. Be in a higher tax bracket (I hope so someday)

Then, compare after tax total cost of outlays in #1 and #2 above, to the 2016 penalty of 2.5% of your income. The extra cost will be worth staying "insured".

Ex of my agent friend with family of 4:

30% tax bracket at 200k of income (penalty = $5000)
$800/mo premium = 9600/year
$6650 HSA contribution.

Total outlays = $16,250 - 30% = $11,375 (after tax deductions)
Then minus the $6650 you still have in your HSA to keep = $4725

Your cost of insurance (even at $800/mo premium) is less your penalty of $5000. It's magic with the tax code, if you do it right.

But yes, I can see the start of the deterioration of the Off exchange higher income market. You can kiss the 400% to 600% FPL folks goodbye. They will be priced out of the market.

 

[AllenChicago]

Every time premiums increase on QHPlans, sales of Short Term Medical increase as well. There's a direct correlation. STM is a mind-field, but better than no coverage.

How high would that brilliant penalty-tax need to be for people to say, "You know what? That freakin penalty, plus the financial & Quality-of-Care risks from not having health insurance aren't worth it. I'm going to pay the high premium, and work to get the current clowns voted out of office!"

 

[kgmom219]

I've run the numbers already, and the only way to make it work is to compare the following and do an HSA:

1. Can you tax deduct your premiums as self employed (I can)
2. Buy 6k HDHP and fully fund your HSA account $6650 (I do)
3. Be in a higher tax bracket (I hope so someday)

Then, compare after tax total cost of outlays in #1 and #2 above, to the 2016 penalty of 2.5% of your income. The extra cost will be worth staying "insured".

Ex of my agent friend with family of 4:

30% tax bracket at 200k of income (penalty = $5000)
$800/mo premium = 9600/year
$6650 HSA contribution.

Total outlays = $16,250 - 30% = $11,375 (after tax deductions)
Then minus the $6650 you still have in your HSA to keep = $4725

Your cost of insurance (even at $800/mo premium) is less your penalty of $5000. It's magic with the tax code, if you do it right.

But yes, I can see the start of the deterioration of the Off exchange higher income market. You can kiss the 400% to 600% FPL folks goodbye. They will be priced out of the market.

AND you might even NEED insurance. You know for a bad diagnosis or something. I've heard that sometimes happen.

They are not going to be priced out of the market. Everyone makes choices. You want to go without coverage, be my guest. You don't get to say "I have 4 iphones with unlimited data in my house but I can't afford health insurance". That's crap.

 

[STIBROKER]

"I have 4 iphones with unlimited data in my house but I can't afford health insurance". That's crap.

oh man can I use that...................

 

[bill3173]

But yes, I can see the start of the deterioration of the Off exchange higher income market. You can kiss the 400% to 600% FPL folks goodbye. They will be priced out of the market.

Can't disagree with anything you said, but what amazes me even more is that I don't hear too much complaining.

The only way 400-600 can pay these premiums is too cut back and for what? to do their part in this new militantly socialist Country? How much do the people benefiting even care? Wouldn't they have been just as happy with free beer and cell phones with a data plan?

 

[bobson]

BUT you get a commission on your policy.......

Depends on the company...

 

[healther]

I've run the numbers already, and the only way to make it work is to compare the following and do an HSA:

1. Can you tax deduct your premiums as self employed (I can)
2. Buy 6k HDHP and fully fund your HSA account $6650 (I do)
3. Be in a higher tax bracket (I hope so someday)

This is what we do, and what I recommend to most of my clients 400% and above. They typically take my recommendation after a bit of number crunching.

 

[HealthGuy]

Bill DOES make a good point...I have a few high income families that deliberately make the choice to not by a qualified plan, BUT buy short term perpetually and take the penalty...At least that is still an option for the healthy...Until that is taken away as well or legislated away...