Face to Face Required? You Be the Judge.

[agentjhc]

When I did appointment paperwork for CIGNA/HS, they asked the qurstion, did I plan to do conduct telephonic sales. I guess I'll find out their requirements soon.

 

[sman]

I've heard about their F2F requirement only on this forum. I've always wondered about a couple of things: 1) Why does their annual certification, which is where they set out their rules for agents regarding their products, mention nothing about F2F being required? They accept AHIP as part of their own annual certification and AHIP specifically addresses the issue in the material and in an exam question. If their company policy differs, this would be the place to make that clear. 2) If they require F2F why do they have an online enrollment application on the agent portal that sends an email to the applicant to sign electronically? This seems designed specifically for agent-assisted, non-F2F situations. In a F2F situation it seems much easier to complete a paper application than deal with a two-step online process. It seems there is some lack of clarity about two different things: 1) giving plan-specific information when requested over the phone and then sending enrollment information to complete on their own and submit electronically or by mailing back a paper application, and 2) taking an enrollment over the phone that the agent completes on the call. The latter is clearly not allowed by CMS or carriers. The former seems clearly allowed by CMS so long as the initial contact was compliant (for example, not a cold call). In fact, it appears that an agent who refuses to provide specific plan information when requested on the phone and instead requires a F2F meeting is in violation. Humana's language in the quotes in previous posts connects "sales presentation and enrollment." But when those two are not connected, as in a non-F2F sales presentation where enrollment occurs later by the beneficiary doesn't seem to be addressed by them in anything I've seen. I do all of my appointments F2F except for a rare spouse of an existing client situation, and write 90% med supp, so fortunately this isn't a problem i have to contend with.

I had this discussion with the manager over Georgia (employed by Humana). He is adamant we cannot mail an enrollment kit and have it mailed back to us to submit.

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When I did appointment paperwork for CIGNA/HS, they asked the qurstion, did I plan to do conduct telephonic sales. I guess I'll find out their requirements soon.

Virtually every application I submitted last year with Cigna was originally mailed to the client and then mailed back to me. Prior to getting appointed with them I asked the local manager if this was allowed and he said yes (the discussion was via email so I have it in writing).

However, they later asked me to provide SOA's for these applications. I didn't get SOA's signed because the enrollment kits were mailed (no F2F). My personal rep with Cigna thought this was going to be an issue. He didn't think mailing the kits was allowed. I then forwarded my email from the manager and never heard another thing on it.

And for what it's worth, on every fax cover sheet I wrote there was no SOA because the enrollment kits were mailed.

 

[agentjhc]

I had this discussion with the manager over Georgia (employed by Humana). He is adamant we cannot mail an enrollment kit and have it mailed back to us to submit.

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Virtually every application I submitted last year with Cigna was originally mailed to the client and then mailed back to me. Prior to getting appointed with them I asked the local manager if this was allowed and he said yes (the discussion was via email so I have it in writing).

However, they later asked me to provide SOA's for these applications. I didn't get SOA's signed because the enrollment kits were mailed (no F2F). My personal rep with Cigna thought this was going to be an issue. He didn't think mailing the kits was allowed. I then forwarded my email from the manager and never heard another thing on it.

And for what it's worth, on every fax cover sheet I wrote there was no SOA because the enrollment kits were mailed.

Did you record conversation ?

 

[sshafran]

Did you record conversation ?

Why would you need to?

Enrollment kits mailed... app mailed back. It's similar to f2f sales, in that it's not a telephonic enrollment.

 

[agentjhc]

I have only worked local thus far and have not completed enrollments via mail. Could be something I need to look into. Looks like Humana doesn't approve, but it looks like UHC and CIGNA allow.

 

[WCMason]

I have only worked local thus far and have not completed enrollments via mail. Could be something I need to look into. Looks like Humana doesn't approve, but it looks like UHC and CIGNA allow.

UHC puts right on the application a box to check that app was mailed in. Silver Script does one better, putting two boxes, one to check that SOA is included with app due to F2F, or no SOA included because app was mailed to the agent. Both are evidence that CMS does not require F2F. Carriers being clear about this can be pretty simple. It will be interesting to see if there are any changes when the carrier I write most finishes its acquisition of the one I write least, though not holding out any high hopes.

 

[agentjhc]

Have you been writing MS with the "new" Aetna ?

 

[WCMason]

Have you been writing MS with the "new" Aetna ?

Not sure if I follow the "new" reference but I have been able to write a few Aetna CLI apps this year.

 

[agentjhc]

Not sure if I follow the "new" reference but I have been able to write a few Aetna CLI apps this year.

Not CLI, Not ACI, Aetna Life and Health. I guess not new, but newer than Continental and Am Continental.

 

[sshafran]

The bottom line is the guidelines precluding F2F are for call centers who tend to employ non-licensed people, not those of us who are licensed and actually understand that Humana's position is pure bullsheit.

How do they get away with employing non-licensed people?

Do they just w2 the reps for an hourly and assign all comp to the head of the call center?

Forgive my ignorance, but I thought even those types of setups would have to be filled by licensed people...

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