NEED HELP! Salvaged car, owned by insurance company, cannot sell.

[tannerp123]

Hey there, I have a small dealership here in Florida. I purchased a Lexus a few months back under the impression that it was clean with no issues, I was given the VIN# before I went to get it and it came back perfect. I took a drive up to Alabama to see it even though I was weary about flood damage after the recent hurricane but there was no corrosion, rust, mold/mildew, just nothing. The VIN# plate as well as the sticker in the door matched the VIN# I was given before I went to see it. It runs and drives like new, so I was given the go ahead and bought it.

I took it to 4 of my mechanics for inspections because of the thought of flooding, and all of them gave it a clean bill of health and found absolutely no issues. I was giving it a wash one day and noticed the door sticker was peeling off in one corner, I looked closer and noticed that there was another sticker behind it. After peeling the top sticker off I found the original sticker with a different VIN#, I ran that VIN# and it came back salvaged with flood damage. I immediately checked the VIN# plate on the dash and the visible plate was again hiding the original. I tried contacting the person I bought it from and received no answer, I then contacted law enforcement and got detectives involved. The person I bought the car from and his family run a title washing ring, one of his family members even has a dealership selling nothing but salvaged cars. The entire family working with him has the same address as he does and they all have been suspected of acting in this. The detectives and local law enforcement offered no help even though they made contact with him.

I made a contact with ties to law enforcement and the repo business and asked for his advice. He had a friend run the cars VIN# through the law enforcement database and it came back saying that someone tried to get it registered in 3 different states, being denied in each one. He finally got it registered in Alabama and somehow got a clean title for it in his name. The VIN report also said that the car was legally owned by State Farm Insurance meaning we cannot legally sell it.

(Here Is The Big Issue)
Because of history sites not telling the full story, the state of Alabama's negligence, and State Farms negligence I was sold a car by someone who didn't own it and committed many crimes selling it to me the way he did. I cannot take any legal action against him (even with plenty of proof) and I cant sell the car legally even at a huge loss. In talking to some lawyer friends they said that the state of Alabama and State Farm are both somewhat responsible for what happened, but wanting to avoid legal fees mainly because it would take any money I would recover I'm looking for any solutions I can find in order to right this.

Would I be able to recover any money from State Farm because its their vehicle that was supposed to be destroyed?

Is there any option for me to recover any money doing things legally?

Any help is appreciated, I've run out of ideas here and I'm getting burnt out stressing over this.

THANKS!

 

[adjusterjack]

In talking to some lawyer friends they said that the state of Alabama and State Farm are both somewhat responsible for what happened,

How much did you pay those lawyer friends for that bit of legal advice? Will they represent you for free to back it up? Didn't think so.

You're making the same mistake that a lot of people make. You want to sue everybody who DIDN'T do you wrong because you can't or won't sue the people who DID do you wrong.

Like the bank customer who wants to sue the bank because a forger cleaned out his bank account. Can't find, or get anything, from the criminal, but the great big bank with all the money is right there even though the bank did nothing wrong. Or the person who gets shot and wants to sue the gun manufacturer because the criminal has nothing but the great big gun manufacturer with all the money is right there even though the gun manufacturer did nothing wrong.

You can insist until you are blue in the face that Alabama and State Farm are at fault, but the reality is that they aren't and you would learn that (expensively) if you took them both to court.

wanting to avoid legal fees mainly because it would take any money I would recover

That's always the punch line to these kinds of posts.

Would I be able to recover any money from State Farm because its their vehicle that was supposed to be destroyed?

I can guarantee you a "no" to that question. State Farm didn't cover the real stickers with the phony stickers. This is between you and the criminals that scammed you.

Is there any option for me to recover any money doing things legally?

Sure. Dismantle the car. Sell the parts. Cut out and dispose of anything with numbers. Send the rest to the metal recycler.

Oh, wait, that's not exactly legal, is it?

Why not call State Farm and see if you can get the title with the right numbers?

If not, Florida allows for posting a bond to get title. See if you qualify.

http://www.flhsmv.gov/dmv/forms/BTR/82026.pdf

 

[rousemark]

How much did you pay those lawyer friends for that bit of legal advice? Will they represent you for free to back it up? Didn't think so.

You're making the same mistake that a lot of people make. You want to sue everybody who DIDN'T do you wrong because you can't or won't sue the people who DID do you wrong.

Like the bank customer who wants to sue the bank because a forger cleaned out his bank account. Can't find, or get anything, from the criminal, but the great big bank with all the money is right there even though the bank did nothing wrong. Or the person who gets shot and wants to sue the gun manufacturer because the criminal has nothing but the great big gun manufacturer with all the money is right there even though the gun manufacturer did nothing wrong.

You can insist until you are blue in the face that Alabama and State Farm are at fault, but the reality is that they aren't and you would learn that (expensively) if you took them both to court.



That's always the punch line to these kinds of posts.



I can guarantee you a "no" to that question. State Farm didn't cover the real stickers with the phony stickers. This is between you and the criminals that scammed you.



Sure. Dismantle the car. Sell the parts. Cut out and dispose of anything with numbers. Send the rest to the metal recycler.

Oh, wait, that's not exactly legal, is it?

Why not call State Farm and see if you can get the title with the right numbers?

If not, Florida allows for posting a bond to get title. See if you qualify.

http://www.flhsmv.gov/dmv/forms/BTR/82026.pdf

Would you guess that the car was being offered at almost too good to true pricing and greed on the part of the buyer might have played a part? The guy is a pro auto dealer, and should have been more cautious. Not like he was some uniformed buyer off the street.

 

[VolAgent]

There is something being sold here, and it isn't a car.

So let's get this straight, experienced car dealer buys a car in a private transaction and doesn't notice anything about the VIN sticker or plate? Doesn't check anywhere else for the VIN either.

Then once he gets it back, he takes it to not one, but 4 mechanics? And not only that, none of them notice anything about the VIN either.

Turns out, a false sticker and plate were put on top and no one noticed. The vehicle has actually be salvaged out by State Farm. So at some point it suffered enough damage to be totaled, yet is still of a recent enough model year to have enough value to justify getting it and selling it. And no one noticed this?

I'm not really buying this. But assuming it is true, have you notified State Farm you have their property? Might as well and start charging impound fees, that might be all you see out of it. Depending on the loss you could see if your policies will provide any coverage since this is theft.

 

[LostDollar]

OP -- How do you figure State Farm being at fault in this?

AdjusterJack-- just curious. Can flood damaged vehicles be resold in the salvage market like collision damaged ones?

 

[adjusterjack]

have you notified State Farm you have their property? Might as well and start charging impound fees

SF has already been paid for the salvage and won't claim the car, nor will it ever pay impound fees to the hapless car dealer.

Depending on the loss you could see if your policies will provide any coverage since this is theft.

It's not theft. It's fraud. Possibly covered if the dealer bought "false pretenses" coverage. The Dealer's Open Lot coverage on his inventory is Named Perils and "false pretenses" is generally not one of them unless purchased as an optional coverage.

Good idea for him to check his policy, though he might still be out of luck.

 

[adjusterjack]

AdjusterJack-- just curious. Can flood damaged vehicles be resold in the salvage market like collision damaged ones?

Yes.

Flood damage can be repaired by replacing all the soft goods (carpet, seats, etc) and replacing anything else that got water damaged.

Once the estimated repair costs reach the total loss formula or percentage, it goes to salvage just like collision. Salvage companies might even pay more since all the sheet metal and mechanical parts remain undamaged.

 

[VolAgent]

SF has already been paid for the salvage and won't claim the car, nor will it ever pay impound fees to the hapless car dealer.

Probably, but he can also apply to get the title after going unclaimed after so long. Of course, it will still have a salvage title and it may take quite some time which means the car has even less value.

It's not theft. It's fraud. Possibly covered if the dealer bought "false pretenses" coverage. The Dealer's Open Lot coverage on his inventory is Named Perils and "false pretenses" is generally not one of them unless purchased as an optional coverage.

Good idea for him to check his policy, though he might still be out of luck.

It is still theft, the exact definition escapes me at the moment. Theft by false pretenses, voluntary parting? Can't recall exactly which it would fall under by it is theft through fraud.

And you are right, it may not be covered, but it may. At this point absolutely no harm in looking.

But ultimately, I'm not really buying this story right now.

 

[LostDollar]

OP said the vehicle number comes back with state farm's name. Couldd that mean that State Farm had not yet actually sold the vehicle as salvage at some monthly or quarterly auction of their vehicles-so that in essence the vehicle was stolen from State Farm and/or State Farm's custodian salvage yard?

 

[xrac]

If you are a dealer you should be able to file a mechanics lein against the vehicle. The lein can be for storage charges and any work done to the vehicle. At least that could be done here in Indiana. Here it is a process that cost about $200-$300 and takes about 6 weeks. Should be able to get a clear legal title. That is unless this vehicle is listed as stolen and then it is your bad luck.