Purchasing Life Insurance with Possibly Converting

Hard to believe I am complimenting Zander...

The reason the rates from Zander were higher is that they are quoting table rated premiums. The guy at NWM is almost certainly quoting standard. NWM is not known as being a generous underwriter, the odds of you getting standard with any company, much less NWM, are very slim.

The rates you saw from Zander are almost certainly much closer to reality.

This is the problem with comparing quotes, particularly if there is anything impacting insurability. The agent is just picking a rate class and showing it to you, it isn't worth the paper it is printed on. I could show you rates at preferred plus that would blow away NWM, but you'd never get it. I would get your attention and then I'd have to try to sell you on the real rate when it came in. That is probably the game the NWM agent is playing. He wants to reel you in, get you so invested that when he gives you the real rate, you won't bother looking around any more. That or he is clueless and has no real idea what your Crohn's has done to your insurability.

"" I could show you rates at preferred plus that would blow away NWM, but you'd never get it. I would get your attention and then I'd have to try to sell you on the real rate when it came in. That is probably the game the NWM agent is playing. He wants to reel you in, get you so invested that when he gives you the real rate, you won't bother looking around any more.""

Back in the olden days when online quotes were new I would try to explain this to prospects and even said great I can quote you Preferred Plus. Had more success arguing with a rock or my teenage son. My guess is those prospects are still shopping online.
 
"" I could show you rates at preferred plus that would blow away NWM, but you'd never get it. I would get your attention and then I'd have to try to sell you on the real rate when it came in. That is probably the game the NWM agent is playing. He wants to reel you in, get you so invested that when he gives you the real rate, you won't bother looking around any more.""

Back in the olden days when online quotes were new I would try to explain this to prospects and even said great I can quote you Preferred Plus. Had more success arguing with a rock or my teenage son. My guess is those prospects are still shopping online.

The agents that would do this often just hoped you were tired of the hassle and would accept the rates because you didn't want to go through this again.

It's also known as the apology sale. They know going in, you won't qualify for the quoted rate, and just apologize when it comes again in hopes you won't want to look any harder.

Early on as I don't know if they're still there, there was a online group selling out of CA that had a placement rate of about 10% of the policies they'd write. There compensation system was based on apps applied, not placed, so their "agents" would do anything to get an app, didn't care if it was placed as that had nothing to do with their compensation. Every so often I would run across a 45 BMI person convinced by this broker they were super preferred. Nothing you could do to sway them either. I just started screening those high BMI people out.
 
The agents that would do this often just hoped you were tired of the hassle and would accept the rates because you didn't want to go through this again.

It's also known as the apology sale. They know going in, you won't qualify for the quoted rate, and just apologize when it comes again in hopes you won't want to look any harder.

Early on as I don't know if they're still there, there was a online group selling out of CA that had a placement rate of about 10% of the policies they'd write. There compensation system was based on apps applied, not placed, so their "agents" would do anything to get an app, didn't care if it was placed as that had nothing to do with their compensation. Every so often I would run across a 45 BMI person convinced by this broker they were super preferred. Nothing you could do to sway them either. I just started screening those high BMI people out.

Yup, people would call an 800 number off of a radio ad or go online and Select a Quote. I would sometimes try calling the prospect back in a couple of weeks or drip email them. I finally learned that they tended to be unrealistic time suckers.

I have two declines I am working on. Both 10 year term clients of mine. Both had health issues when I placed them and after them telling me they were in perfect health during the app process. instead of taking a blended plan or at least the 20 or thirty-year plan I quoted after they came back rated they decided to go to a cheaper ten year plan. They were going to quit smoking, lose weight, and stop drinking. :twitchy: Fast forward to today. Both declined for things like elevated liver functions, Triglycerides over 1000 in combination with A1Cs of 7+ and in one case pushing 300#s. Now, the options are, see if there may be a rated offer out there, convert to whatever is available, stack some SIWL, or die for free. Oh, and both are madder than hell that the rip off insurance companies want to charge them more. I get to the "do it or don't" point pretty quickly now. I don't sell or talk people into anything, I help them buy.
 
"I don't sell or talk people into anything, I help them buy. "

Same here. Those tend to be clients that stay clients, are little trouble to service and generally just a pleasure to work with. I stopped overcoming objections long ago. The harder you had to talk somebody into something the quicker the chargeback when they change their minds.
 
None of this matters until you have an offer of coverage by the insurance company. You've already been declined once, and this affects your medical records and other insurance companies will also notice.

Generally, companies may give more favorable underwriting decisions for permanent insurance than term. This is because of the growing cash reserves that helps to lower their risk.

Apply for something and get your coverage. What type... is secondary at this point.

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Btw, please tell me that you were quoted at least at a STANDARD underwriting class, right?

If you've been quoted anything "preferred" prior to a medical exam, then you should be prepared to pay more for the coverage you are considering.

What ... 650 wants is to take a term with NWM to benefit himself from the lower price condition in the conversion to permanent 90 years. As early as he can.
However I do not think they will qualify him as he is thinking because of his chronic condition.
His agent should verify the true raiting on the carrier he choose, he should make a permanent policy. NWM is not the best In WL.

You're working with an amateur. I don't blame the company. I blame the agent.

I just ran a quote for Assurity based on age 38 (insurance age closest to birthday):
- 20-year term for $1,000,000 at table 2 rating: $2,490 per year.
- Whole life for $1,000,000, table 2 rating: $17,915 per year.

No additional riders, paid up additions... nothing. Just base policies.


I would be EXTREMELY surprised if you get coverage from NWM for anything close to the premiums you've posted.

Most insurance companies are priced "about the same" for similar coverage. Northwestern Mutual's age 90 policy means that premiums are guaranteed for the given death benefit to age 90. Assurity's Whole Life goes to age 100... so Assurity should be a little less than NWM. Unless this is a very basic policy with guaranteed premiums only, late cash values in the policy, it's blended with a base whole life + term in the same policy, (or you just left off a zero from your post)... I wouldn't expect to pay $1,600 per year for a $1,000,000 whole life policy.


Even the quote from Assurity is more than NWM illustration for the 20 year term. Good part is, they have whole life goes to 100, but honestly, I don't think I would live to be that age, or even 90 for that matter.

That price you put for the whole life just really made me back off, so I think it's in my best interest to make this a basic policy. 2,500 would be a bit pricey for me if that was the official price by NWM. If they think I don't need that big of a policy, I can settle for 500K. I asked for a million cause living in the San Francisco Bay Area is really, and I mean really expensive. Plus, I have debts up the ying tang, especially student loans, so every dollar matters.

I lost my brother a few months ago, and I think he had a policy with Liberty Mutual, but because he started his new job prior to his death, I think they dropped him. So I need a safety net in case something happens to me.
 
Even the quote from Assurity is more than NWM illustration for the 20 year term. Good part is, they have whole life goes to 100, but honestly, I don't think I would live to be that age, or even 90 for that matter.

That price you put for the whole life just really made me back off, so I think it's in my best interest to make this a basic policy. 2,500 would be a bit pricey for me if that was the official price by NWM. If they think I don't need that big of a policy, I can settle for 500K. I asked for a million cause living in the San Francisco Bay Area is really, and I mean really expensive. Plus, I have debts up the ying tang, especially student loans, so every dollar matters.

I lost my brother a few months ago, and I think he had a policy with Liberty Mutual, but because he started his new job prior to his death, I think they dropped him. So I need a safety net in case something happens to me.

Hey I think it is great you are forward thinking on this, but several agents have already told you this and you have finished it. I and any other agent can quote you rates that will blow these away. YOU WILL NOT GET THEM.

Nwm is a great company but if you were declined by Banner who are pretty decent at impaired risk (and yes you are impaired risk, and hey not giving you a hard time I would be too) I would be shocked and aawed if you even got an offer with nwm. At best table 6 to 8 which is extremely generous.

Also you need to answer the question (I may have missed it as to whether you are working or on disability). If I missed it my apologies but this is very important on term applications. As well as all medications and build. VERY IMPORTANT!!

This is from a captive agent who I can tell you up front is not the best place for this condition. Depending on the severity I think the consensus is maybe Prudential, and I would agree.

That said without this info nobody can give solid advice.

There are a lot of agents trying but you are not answering the pertinent questions.
 
I forgot to tell you I got declined by NWM when I was 25 years for Ulcerative Colitis... all I was taking was Colazal (similar to Asacol) .. no remicaid, no Humira , no surgeries.. Granted I was young and young with UC is a major negative with life insurers, and also I wasn't taking my meds .

This does not mean you'll get declined by NWM but I had a mild UC at the time and they were not willing to give a table rating. so like the others have said, be realistic with what you will get.
 
Even the quote from Assurity is more than NWM illustration for the 20 year term. Good part is, they have whole life goes to 100, but honestly, I don't think I would live to be that age, or even 90 for that matter.

With your health condition, I would recommend you look at 30 Year Term. With a condition like Chrons, you want to lock-in coverage for as long as possible.

Midland National/North American has an excellent 30y term, and it is convertible for all 30 years too.

NWM allows conversions, but if I remember correctly, its only for the first 10 years. Ask your agent about that because its a very important thing to know. Also, I do not think NWM sells 30y Term either.

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The others are right, you will not receive a Standard Health Rating with Chrons. The rates you are looking at with NWM are useless. Tell the agent to run rates at "Table 2" and "Table 3", that will be closer to what your actual Premium with NWM will be. Perhaps even Table 4... (some carriers use letters instead of numbers, so it would be "B/C/D" instead of 2/3/4).

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Sorry to hear about your brother. It sounds like he had group life through a former employer. Plans like that should only be thought of as supplemental coverage and not the main policy that protects your loved ones.

Group insurance is gone the minute you leave that employer. You dont own your group life policy, you own your personal life policy.
 
per the OP "Well, there is still inflammation with my Chron's. I had a partial colectomy back in 2013, so most of my colon is gone."

This is a flat decline for NWM on any term with them. at least a table 8+ if they offer Whole life.

The OP obviously needs a better agent and he needs to know that removal of most of a colon is not ever going to be a standard risk.

Skipper
 
per the OP "Well, there is still inflammation with my Chron's. I had a partial colectomy back in 2013, so most of my colon is gone."

This is a flat decline for NWM on any term with them. at least a table 8+ if they offer Whole life.

The OP obviously needs a better agent and he needs to know that removal of most of a colon is not ever going to be a standard risk.

Skipper

Judging by a thread he has reactivated, he is off to SelectQuote and SBLI.
 
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