series7dude
Expert
- 58
I 2nd that...don't even bother getting involved
This is how Mark Rosenthal Sells Ins.
- Thread starter Mark
- Start date
I 2nd that...don't even bother getting involved
rbrucethomson
New Member
- 9
These forums are a fine place for smug arrogance. I'm not interested in trading witty insults and rhetorical one-upmanship. I was attempting to warn in good faith in order to prevent the unnecessary, but foreseeable consequences to the unwitting victims that naturally flow from someone engaging in the unauthorized practice of law. I am finished warning. Continue this practice at your peril.
- Thread starter
- #123
It is up to the agent. But as for as me. I'm going to keep on handing out free living wills to anyone that wants one. I know the pain it can cause a family not to have a living will and how having one can save the family a lot of grief.
I give tons of things to prospects, including a free $1,000 Accidental Death and Dismemberment policy.
I give tons of things to prospects, including a free $1,000 Accidental Death and Dismemberment policy.
There are a lot of agencies around that give the same information and they are far from being lawyers. Just give em the form and start the conversation. It's not like you're filling it out for them. Geez...ya'll are uptight.
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By agencies, I mean governmental agencies, not insurance agencies.
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By agencies, I mean governmental agencies, not insurance agencies.
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Gee! Touchy aren't we?.. I think you started the one-upmanship with the scalpel comment. Love how you toss out an insult and then say you aren't interested in trading witty insults. Is that a tactic you learned in law school? I think I missed that class before I sat for my bar exam (at the Mint Hotel and Casino).
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rbrucethomson
New Member
- 9
You are completely missing the point. As I have stated ad nauseum, anyone can do THEIR OWN will, advance directive, or any other legal document. You, a non-lawyer, may not help them with it. Unless you are that state agency, I suggest you leave it alone. Paralegals and notaries get sued every day for overstepping the bounds. What makes you think you are any different? Instead of google, try lexisweb.com. Search "living wills and unauthorized practice of law."
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Got any real life case examples for this? Did they write up their own forms and get paid for their service?
BTW the site you put up requires $12.50 just to look at an article.
I am sure there are many cases of paralegals being sued for overstepping their bounds.. But the question here is, "Are there any examples of one being sued for telling someone about the need for a living will or advance directive?"
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Mark: This is one of your agents??
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rbrucethomson
New Member
- 9
I am sure there are many cases of paralegals being sued for overstepping their bounds.. But the question here is, "Are there any examples of one being sued for telling someone about the need for a living will or advance directive?"
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Mark: This is one of your agents??
I received unsolicited marketing materials from Mr. Rosenthal. I am not one of his agents.
The following quotes are from an advisory opinion of the Illinois State Bar Association:
"Because the preparation of an advance directive is a legal service, as is the counseling of individuals on the specific design, legal meaning and implications of advance directives . . ."
1994 WL 904177 (Ill.St.Bar.Assn.), 1.
"So long as all legal services were performed by [Law] Firm A, [non-lawyer] would not be engaged in the unauthorized practice of law and thus, Firm A would not be aiding in the unauthorized practice of law."
1994 WL 904177 (Ill.St.Bar.Assn.), 2
I take this to mean that, in Illinois, talking to a client about the design, effect, or legal meaning of an advance directive is the practice of law. You may have a different interpretation. I just read a case from Ohio about an insurance agent who was fined $10,000 for preparing living wills and other legal documents.
If you want to look it up: Dayton Bar Association v. Addison, 107 Ohio St. 3d 153 (2005).
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As far as it goes at this moment I would think those who see no potential land mines are still going to do as they do. I'm on the side of why be at risk because the definition of what's considered practicing law isn't something I deal with everyday so there is a possibility of doing something that may seem minor to me but may come back to bite me.
It's kind of like not being securities licensed and talking about securities even a little bit can get someone in hot water. That's why when it comes to things like Will or Trust or other legal documents I offer another option or direct people to consult with an Attorney.
Consider the Annuity drama.. All it takes is for one person to say he/she said this or he/she helped me fill out this part of the form because in most instances I find it hard to believe that people just take the form and fill it out without asking any questions.
It's kind of like not being securities licensed and talking about securities even a little bit can get someone in hot water. That's why when it comes to things like Will or Trust or other legal documents I offer another option or direct people to consult with an Attorney.
Consider the Annuity drama.. All it takes is for one person to say he/she said this or he/she helped me fill out this part of the form because in most instances I find it hard to believe that people just take the form and fill it out without asking any questions.
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