Annuity Recomendation

[Franz Kafka]

I own an annuity that your speaking of because the government forces me to pay into it. How is the SS trust fund working out? It is essentially a government ran ponzi scheme.

The problem with SS was ACTUARIAL - namely, the miscalculation on longevity of the insured (yes SS is an insurance program executed under Federal Insurance Contribution Act). The government has PROMISED to pay and their promise is as good as their ability to collect revenue. Imagine if the congress had passed the G.W.'s bill and privatized SS. Do you think seniors will still be getting their $1,000 a month?

I love your passion but your rant just solidifies my thoughts that you probably have little to no experience in the securities world (a RR is not in the securities world they are SALESMEN) and extremely ignorant.

There is no brainwashing. It is called experience and due diligence.

Tell you what, you take 50k of your own money and I will do the same. We both implement our own strategies and you pick the time frame (6 months, 1 year, 5 years, 10 years, whatever) and at the end of that time we compare account values. I will give you 20x odds on whatever amount you want to wager that my account will outperform yours. Quit bashing an idea that works if you are not willing to put your money where your mouth is.

You missed the whole point because of your brainwashing. The point was - the retirement funds should NOT be invested because it's money that people CANNOT afford to lose. I have no problem with people doing whatever they want with money they can afford to lose. You however have convinced yourself that you could take people's money that they could not afford to lose, play with it and believed that it would never be lost. That's not strategy - that's faith, faith in something that's not promised. Annuity is a PROMISE. There's no strategy involved.

If you're offering a wager on trading, I would not take it because 20x handicap would not be fair to you. In future don't spew out wagering offers like that until you find out who you're betting against. If I double that 50K in 6 month, are you going to pay me $1mm? Man's word is a bond. Don't treat it lightly.

 

[MrProducer]

This is quite entertaining....wagers, name calling, kitchen sinks flying, etc.

With that said, let's get back on point here. Rizzle, I agree with ob1 in that you should definitely look for a shorter period in this annuity. You are still young enough to where in a few years you'll remember that you have an annuity, and can re-assess the market and products available at that time.


Good luck to you.

 

[VolAgent]

This is quite entertaining....wagers, name calling, kitchen sinks flying, etc.

With that said, let's get back on point here. Rizzle, I agree with ob1 in that you should definitely look for a shorter period in this annuity. You are still young enough to where in a few years you'll remember that you have an annuity, and can re-assess the market and products available at that time.

Also, try to find an annuity that offers a bonus on premiums. There are still a few out there. It's "free money", when compared to annuities that do not offer such. Why not take the "free money", right?

Good luck to you.

There is no such thing as free money. Never think a "bonus" on an annuity is. Even the marketing material tells you it really isn't free. You give up in caps, interest, etc. to get that bonus. The question is, for your time frame, are you better off with or without the bonus.

 

[MrProducer]

There is no such thing as free money. Never think a "bonus" on an annuity is. Even the marketing material tells you it really isn't free. You give up in caps, interest, etc. to get that bonus. The question is, for your time frame, are you better off with or without the bonus.

I realized how dumb that sounded and edited it out....unfortunately your reply was faster than my editing!

Thank you for the correction.....I guess my old age shows sometimes

 

[VolAgent]

I realized how dumb that sounded and edited it out....unfortunately your reply was faster than my editing!

Thank you for the correction.....I guess my old age shows sometimes

Hey, as long as you realized. I'm ambivalent about bonuses. Franz calls them smoke and mirrors and other people swear by them. I say it just depends.

 

[njh_lfg]

The problem with SS was ACTUARIAL - namely, the miscalculation on longevity of the insured (yes SS is an insurance program executed under Federal Insurance Contribution Act). The government has PROMISED to pay and their promise is as good as their ability to collect revenue. Imagine if the congress had passed the G.W.'s bill and privatized SS. Do you think seniors will still be getting their $1,000 a month?



You missed the whole point because of your brainwashing. The point was - the retirement funds should NOT be invested because it's money that people CANNOT afford to lose. I have no problem with people doing whatever they want with money they can afford to lose. You however have convinced yourself that you could take people's money that they could not afford to lose, play with it and believed that it would never be lost. That's not strategy - that's faith, faith in something that's not promised. Annuity is a PROMISE. There's no strategy involved.

If you're offering a wager on trading, I would not take it because 20x handicap would not be fair to you. In future don't spew out wagering offers like that until you find out who you're betting against. If I double that 50K in 6 month, are you going to pay me $1mm? Man's word is a bond. Don't treat it lightly.

1. check this out http://www.hmc.harvard.edu/docs/Final_Annual_Report_2011.pdf Yes that is actual returns.

2. You will not double your money in 6 months in an annuity.
3. I am willing to hold true to my original wager and we can cap the 20x out at $1m. I doubt you would be willing to do that.
4. I have a feeling I can cover any wager you would be physically able to pay (judging by your "rational" replies)
5. An annuity is a promise backed on the claims paying ability of the company. An carrier can go bust, not have a dime to pay back contract holders and then let the state guarantee fund pay out up to the maximum (which in most states is around 100k).

 

[MrProducer]

JER-RY!! JER-RY!! JER-RY!! JER-RY!! :bump::bump::bump::bump:

 

[nathan.lee]

Wow...this got personal very quickly!

Rizzle,

Since this is your 401K and you seem intent on placing this money into an FIA and given your age, I too would recommend a shorter term product that would allow you to revist the market in a few years. Don't worry about a bonus as you will "pay" for that with lower cap rates.

If you were considering adding NA's Income Pay rider to the Charter 14...well that is an entirely different conversation.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
As an aside--

Nathan(njh_lfg),

You may want to update the Annuity Rates Now website that your "ARN" signature links to. I noticed that some of the cap rates and income rider information seems out of date. Just a heads up.

 

[iceco1d]

Try having a family member a few years away from retirement who bought the 401k scam (yes, 401ks are pure scams IMHO) and now is about 50% down in her portfolio with no chance at retirement.

Eventually this scam is going to have to be exposed. You might as well hit Vegas and play craps with your retirement savings rather then put it your 401k.

Employees are asked to "check boxes" next to investment vehicles typically after the company's "financial advisor" has a 6 hour meeting. Does anyone know why people REALLY select their 401k portfolio? By how cool the names are:

"Wow, the Magellan Capital Growth Fund? Sounds great!" Then they allocate which percentage goes into which vehicle.

Of course, they're all taught the same rubbish; "You're young so get risky! Get 70% into those aggressive growth funds!!!!"

401Ks are not a scam. The problem is the people are generally too stupid and inept to do what's good for them. They don't seek advice because they are lazy, arrogant, or both.

Here's a simple balanced asset allocation fund from American Funds: ABALX Performance Overview | AMERICAN BALANCED FUND, CLASS A Stock - Yahoo! Finance

Average 5 year return of 1.2%. Average 10 year return of 4.3%. Not lighting the world on fire, but certainly not "down 50% and have no chance of retiring!"

And that's a simple "turnkey" balanced mutual fund from one of the largest fund companies on Earth. Any dolt could've dollar cost averaged into that fund, and every fund company has something similar.

This "they are down 50% and have no chance of retirement" is old. If they are close to retirement, they should've been in a moderate allocation that wasn't down 50% in the first place (in fact, half or less than half of 50%) in 2008. And if they would've continued to put money into their accounts, and not screw with it, they would be POSITIVE 2007 - 2012, even doing something as simple as ABALX.

Blaming the market, or blaming mutual funds, for the ineptitude of the general public is stupid.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Yes I own them myself and yes I have traded them for profit.

I own an annuity that your speaking of because the government forces me to pay into it. How is the SS trust fund working out? It is essentially a government ran ponzi scheme.

I love your passion but your rant just solidifies my thoughts that you probably have little to no experience in the securities world (a RR is not in the securities world they are SALESMEN) and extremely ignorant.

There is no brainwashing. It is called experience and due diligence.

Tell you what, you take 50k of your own money and I will do the same. We both implement our own strategies and you pick the time frame (6 months, 1 year, 5 years, 10 years, whatever) and at the end of that time we compare account values. I will give you 20x odds on whatever amount you want to wager that my account will outperform yours. Quit bashing an idea that works if you are not willing to put your money where your mouth is.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


You are correct. Financial forecasting must be done to find the potential cash-flow needs and build the portfolio around this model. Generally I have 10-15% cash on hand in these accounts and jump at opportunities to sell and take a profits or sell to minimize risk or loss.

Whoa there gangster! Put down the RIA Koolaid for a second. Most RRs are dually registered as IARs as well. And don't kid yourself, you're a salesman too. RR, insurance agent, or IAR are all selling something and you know it.

Ethics are found from within, not what licenses you carry.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

I no longer believe in the stock market as a place to grow the average person's money. If I had to state why it would turn into a 100 page post. Research.

Does it have anything to do with whether or not you're licensed to sell securities?
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

The problem with SS was ACTUARIAL - namely, the miscalculation on longevity of the insured (yes SS is an insurance program executed under Federal Insurance Contribution Act). The government has PROMISED to pay and their promise is as good as their ability to collect revenue. Imagine if the congress had passed the G.W.'s bill and privatized SS. Do you think seniors will still be getting their $1,000 a month?



You missed the whole point because of your brainwashing. The point was - the retirement funds should NOT be invested because it's money that people CANNOT afford to lose. I have no problem with people doing whatever they want with money they can afford to lose. You however have convinced yourself that you could take people's money that they could not afford to lose, play with it and believed that it would never be lost. That's not strategy - that's faith, faith in something that's not promised. Annuity is a PROMISE. There's no strategy involved.

If you're offering a wager on trading, I would not take it because 20x handicap would not be fair to you. In future don't spew out wagering offers like that until you find out who you're betting against. If I double that 50K in 6 month, are you going to pay me $1mm? Man's word is a bond. Don't treat it lightly.

The fact of the matter is that there are investment strategies that are GUARANTEED to outperform a FIA.

If someone wanted to, they could buy bonds and index call options, cut out the insurance company and the insurance agent, and make more money.

There are other investment strategies that can offer guarantees (such as stock portfolios that utilize put options), structured notes and other products. The list goes on.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

The problem with SS was ACTUARIAL - namely, the miscalculation on longevity of the insured (yes SS is an insurance program executed under Federal Insurance Contribution Act). The government has PROMISED to pay and their promise is as good as their ability to collect revenue. Imagine if the congress had passed the G.W.'s bill and privatized SS. Do you think seniors will still be getting their $1,000 a month?



You missed the whole point because of your brainwashing. The point was - the retirement funds should NOT be invested because it's money that people CANNOT afford to lose. I have no problem with people doing whatever they want with money they can afford to lose. You however have convinced yourself that you could take people's money that they could not afford to lose, play with it and believed that it would never be lost. That's not strategy - that's faith, faith in something that's not promised. Annuity is a PROMISE. There's no strategy involved.

If you're offering a wager on trading, I would not take it because 20x handicap would not be fair to you. In future don't spew out wagering offers like that until you find out who you're betting against. If I double that 50K in 6 month, are you going to pay me $1mm? Man's word is a bond. Don't treat it lightly.

The fact of the matter is that there are investment strategies that are GUARANTEED to outperform a FIA.

If someone wanted to, they could buy bonds and index call options, cut out the insurance company and the insurance agent, and make more money.

There are other investment strategies that can offer guarantees (such as stock portfolios that utilize put options), structured notes and other products. The list goes on.

 

[VolAgent]

401Ks are not a scam. The problem is the people are generally too stupid and inept to do what's good for them. They don't seek advice because they are lazy, arrogant, or both.

Here's a simple balanced asset allocation fund from American Funds: ABALX Performance Overview | AMERICAN BALANCED FUND, CLASS A Stock - Yahoo! Finance

Average 5 year return of 1.2%. Average 10 year return of 4.3%. Not lighting the world on fire, but certainly not "down 50% and have no chance of retiring!"

And that's a simple "turnkey" balanced mutual fund from one of the largest fund companies on Earth. Any dolt could've dollar cost averaged into that fund, and every fund company has something similar.

This "they are down 50% and have no chance of retirement" is old. If they are close to retirement, they should've been in a moderate allocation that wasn't down 50% in the first place (in fact, half or less than half of 50%) in 2008. And if they would've continued to put money into their accounts, and not screw with it, they would be POSITIVE 2007 - 2012, even doing something as simple as ABALX.

Blaming the market, or blaming mutual funds, for the ineptitude of the general public is stupid.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


Whoa there gangster! Put down the RIA Koolaid for a second. Most RRs are dually registered as IARs as well. And don't kid yourself, you're a salesman too. RR, insurance agent, or IAR are all selling something and you know it.

Ethics are found from within, not what licenses you carry.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


Does it have anything to do with whether or not you're licensed to sell securities?
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


The fact of the matter is that there are investment strategies that are GUARANTEED to outperform a FIA.

If someone wanted to, they could buy bonds and index call options, cut out the insurance company and the insurance agent, and make more money.

There are other investment strategies that can offer guarantees (such as stock portfolios that utilize put options), structured notes and other products. The list goes on.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


The fact of the matter is that there are investment strategies that are GUARANTEED to outperform a FIA.

If someone wanted to, they could buy bonds and index call options, cut out the insurance company and the insurance agent, and make more money.

There are other investment strategies that can offer guarantees (such as stock portfolios that utilize put options), structured notes and other products. The list goes on.

Seriously, 1.2% over five years and 4.3% over ten years, and I had to put my money in the market to get it??

I personally own mutual funds. But if that is the best you can do, I'd keep my mouth shut. You are bragging about getting CD and annuity returns, like American Funds actually accomplished something. Also, do these returns account for loads, 12b-1 fees, and other management fees?