Assurant CI and Accident

[ksigmtsu]

I was not stating that at all, sorry to not be clear enough. I believe that you can find better CI products than assurant. I would prefer Colorado Bankers, assurity or american general. In every scenario I've quoted one of the above has been a better option to Assurants CI Rider.

The new CI plan they're running is a lot different than the old rider. It looks more like Colorado Bankers, wrapped in a 10 or 20 year term policy, cap of 100k, and pays benefits for a ton of conditions.

Full Benefit for:
Blindness, Cancer Type A, Coma, Deafness, Kidney Failure, Heart Attack, Loss of Limb, Major Burns, Organ Transplant, Paralysis, Stroke

25% benefit: Alzheimer's disease, Cancer Type B, Heart Valve Surgery, Coronary Artery Bypass Graft (Stint).

$36 a month on 50,000 on a 30 year old puts it right in the ballpark of colorado bankers. It appears to be a lot more scalable though. You can drop the benefit down all the way to 5000, and on a 30 year old that's a 7.26$ premium. The life portion can be half the CI benefit as well, which allows some play in the setup to price.

That little accident plan in the most expensive single person configuration runs $17 a month on a 30 y/o man. Beats the WBA rates by 5 dollars. Hell you can do the accident plus a 5000 CI plan and stay around the price of a single WBA policy. The amounts paid seem to be lined up directly with most major medical copay amounts.

100$ for ER visit, urgent care or doctor
35$ for follow ups
$200 for ambulance
$300 a day for hospitalization
$500 a day for ICU
$125 a day for room rate lodging
$200 for blood transfusion
$200 for major diagnostic exam (mri/ct)
$35 a day for physical therapy
$750 for prosthesis
$150 a day for rehab
$100 for a concussion
$3750 for closed fracture
$5000 for open fracture
$20000 for coma
$25000 for paralysis 2 limbs
$50000 for paralysis 4 limbs
$50000 for accidental death
$50000 for accidental dismemberment

Looks slick if you place it alongside a policy with very similar copays and deductibles to the amounts it covers for the price. It doesn't sound quite as good as the 15000 benefit on the AIG policy when you put them side by side though.. although no deductible on this one, and the CI benefit is better.

I'm curious how it will play out.. I know I believe in a sales perspective that saying 15000 a year sounds a hell of a lot better than having a whole sheet of numbers to confuse someone with.

 

[AllenChicago]

There is nothing wrong with writing a supplemental CI plan. Sometimes on the major med, there is NO answer but getting a higher deductible to keep the costs down and sell them a separate CI plan. Selling them a CI plan is NOT doing the devils work.

Writing a CI plan along side a high deductible health plan makes a lot of sense and is a smart thing to do. Most of my clients are small business owners. They purchase $7,500 to $20,000 deductible major medical with a CI/Life and Accident plan as a package. The client gets great overall coverage and the agent gets a lucrative multi-stream commission.

With major medical commissions being cut, it makes more sense than ever from our point of view to sell "packages" like this.
-Allen

 

[COInsguy]

The new CI plan they're running is a lot different than the old rider. It looks more like Colorado Bankers, wrapped in a 10 or 20 year term policy, cap of 100k, and pays benefits for a ton of conditions.

Full Benefit for:
Blindness, Cancer Type A, Coma, Deafness, Kidney Failure, Heart Attack, Loss of Limb, Major Burns, Organ Transplant, Paralysis, Stroke

25% benefit: Alzheimer's disease, Cancer Type B, Heart Valve Surgery, Coronary Artery Bypass Graft (Stint).

$36 a month on 50,000 on a 30 year old puts it right in the ballpark of colorado bankers. It appears to be a lot more scalable though. You can drop the benefit down all the way to 5000, and on a 30 year old that's a 7.26$ premium. The life portion can be half the CI benefit as well, which allows some play in the setup to price.

That little accident plan in the most expensive single person configuration runs $17 a month on a 30 y/o man. Beats the WBA rates by 5 dollars. Hell you can do the accident plus a 5000 CI plan and stay around the price of a single WBA policy. The amounts paid seem to be lined up directly with most major medical copay amounts.

100$ for ER visit, urgent care or doctor
35$ for follow ups
$200 for ambulance
$300 a day for hospitalization
$500 a day for ICU
$125 a day for room rate lodging
$200 for blood transfusion
$200 for major diagnostic exam (mri/ct)
$35 a day for physical therapy
$750 for prosthesis
$150 a day for rehab
$100 for a concussion
$3750 for closed fracture
$5000 for open fracture
$20000 for coma
$25000 for paralysis 2 limbs
$50000 for paralysis 4 limbs
$50000 for accidental death
$50000 for accidental dismemberment

Looks slick if you place it alongside a policy with very similar copays and deductibles to the amounts it covers for the price. It doesn't sound quite as good as the 15000 benefit on the AIG policy when you put them side by side though.. although no deductible on this one, and the CI benefit is better.

I'm curious how it will play out.. I know I believe in a sales perspective that saying 15000 a year sounds a hell of a lot better than having a whole sheet of numbers to confuse someone with.

Thanks for the breakdown, I might have to log in now for the first time in a while and download all the info this weekend. Based on what you said that is very comparable to CBL for CI, looks a tad different, but Colorado Bankers you have to stick a $20 premium on, sometimes you don't need that much.

With the accident plan I think you have to use the 20% rule...the client doesn't need to know all the amounts but more I explain it like this: Your accident plan has different amounts of payment for different treatments and procedures, most accidents will add up to a substantial amount and relieve a good portion of your out of pocket costs.

I think that is a clear explanation that my clients get the idea, if they don't we talk about an example and look at the numbers. For the price, it will compliment well with a hdhp very well it appears.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

With major medical commissions being cut, it makes more sense than ever from our point of view to sell "packages" like this.
-Allen

It's always made sense, it has nothing to do with commission cuts. Why would you advise someone to take a low deductible health plan in this market.

For example: policy last night $2,500 HSA vs $1,250 HSA United 100 the client wanted the $1,250 deductible. We did the math on annual cost difference. It was $1,537 more for the lower deductible.

Here's an easy explanation to clients: Your GUARANTEED to pay a higher premium on the lower deductible, on the higher deductible you are risking the POTENTIAL of spending approximately that same amount. Once you get that through someones head a higher deductible w/accident & CI is an easy sale..... Plus you just made room for a brand new life policy to help supplement retirement!

 

[HealthGuy]

Somebody still show me how we can replace 80% of our income when it goes away selling major med selling this stuff (CI and accident). If commissions become non existent, like child only policies of BXBX of TX, there is no way this stuff is going to replace an income. Unless you are selling a sh@tload of life insurance, which very few health guys do successfully, which I do admit. Selling CI and accident and a life case when you can WILL NOT replace an income if major med commissions become non existent or 5% or under. Somebody prove me wrong with the math, I dare anybody to show me a 100k career selling accident and CI while being a marginal life producer.

 

[somarco]

There are two key issues with CI plans that go beyond the raw numbers.

1) How are the benefits treated? Are they excluded from income like a traditional health insurance policy or are they considered akin to an accelerated death benefit and taxed?

2) How strict (or loose) are the qualifying definitions? Translation, how difficult is it to collect on these plans?

 

[COInsguy]

Somebody still show me how we can replace 80% of our income when it goes away selling major med selling this stuff (CI and accident). If commissions become non existent, like child only policies of BXBX of TX, there is no way this stuff is going to replace an income. Unless you are selling a sh@tload of life insurance, which very few health guys do successfully, which I do admit. Selling CI and accident and a life case when you can WILL NOT replace an income if major med commissions become non existent or 5% or under. Somebody prove me wrong with the math, I dare anybody to show me a 100k career selling accident and CI while being a marginal life producer.

Something worth checking out, some videos from Jeremiah @ Norvax. I would say the best stuff to come out of norvax actually:

Norvax UVC League

I wouldn't say it answers your question completely but has some good stuff that is worth listening to while you work.

 

[HealthGuy]

COInsGuy: I have seen all three videos, I just don't believe the message - sorry I'm hard to convince. REPLACE 80% of our major medical income with dental, CI, accident, LIFE, LTC? Come on. I'm not that gullible.

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

Individual health is a unique product. It's a commodity and carriers have made it easy to sell online.

The only other insurance product that fits the online model that's also a commodity is auto. Leads, although maligned, are plentiful.

When you start getting into life, supps, ltc, etc...the truth of the matter is most agents will crash and burn trying to sell online. A small handful can pull it off. Not many. Agents turning to these products will be back at kitchen tables.

 

[COInsguy]

COInsGuy: I have seen all three videos, I just don't believe the message - sorry I'm hard to convince. REPLACE 80% of our major medical income with dental, CI, accident, LIFE, LTC? Come on. I'm not that gullible.

I never said it was the total solution! My personal game plan is much more comprehensive than just those videos to keep my income and my agents income increasing not decreasing. I did, however, write down 3 or 4 ideas out of the videos that I liked that's all I was getting at.

Norvax is in the business of selling the software, those videos help sell brokeroffice and that is the main purpose. But they have some valuable parts to them as well. I don't sell software soooo lil different approach than he is showing for my team lol

 

[AllGold]

So what will Assurant be selling? They ditched Max plan so now it's CoreMed and One Deductible.

I'm not sure if that was a real question or a statement but if was a question then you answered it.

Although they also have a revised version of Health Access on the way.