10% Penalty on Annuity

[VolAgent]

I don't think we are that far apart in belief then.

I don't expect a buyer to know exactly how everything works. Although as you and Tyler proved, it is impossible for advisors to know everything as well. Which is why there is no shame in telling someone you'll have to find out and get back to them.

I simply believe that assuming the buyer was given honest answers, and pertinent facts as the advisor understood the situation, then it is the buyer's decision and the buyer owns it.

Unfortunately, the difficulty is in determining what did the advisor know and what did the advisor share. All you have to go on is the buyer's memory and the advisor's notes when there is a dispute later on.

 

[Life Hawk]

I don't think we are that far apart in belief then.

I don't expect a buyer to know exactly how everything works. Although as you and Tyler proved, it is impossible for advisors to know everything as well. Which is why there is no shame in telling someone you'll have to find out and get back to them.

I simply believe that assuming the buyer was given honest answers, and pertinent facts as the advisor understood the situation, then it is the buyer's decision and the buyer owns it.

Unfortunately, the difficulty is in determining what did the advisor know and what did the advisor share. All you have to go on is the buyer's memory and the advisor's notes when there is a dispute later on.

Back to the suitablity form. How often have you explained something to a client only have their eyes glaz over and miss about 75% of what you just said. Not an expert but have sold some NTQ product. Gains are taxed principle is not, but it is subjectt to IRS rules and penalized accordingly. Just the basics a "fly over view", but the person who asked the question did not want to mention the company. Sorry, but if I was having those issues, you bet I would mention the name. This just smells a bit fishy the longer its discussed. My $0.02

 

[VolAgent]

Back to the suitablity form. How often have you explained something to a client only have their eyes glaz over and miss about 75% of what you just said. Not an expert but have sold some NTQ product. Gains are taxed principle is not, but it is subjectt to IRS rules and penalized accordingly. Just the basics a "fly over view", but the person who asked the question did not want to mention the company. Sorry, but if I was having those issues, you bet I would mention the name. This just smells a bit fishy the longer its discussed. My $0.02

I learned a long time ago, not only do you get just one person's version here, but half the time they are holding back as well. So I try to temper my responses knowing there is a lot more than what I'm being told. That said, I can only work with the information given.

As presented, it does appear there is a problem. But I find the response of the compliance person to be interesting. Even if the firm's compliance person, I find it hard to believe they are just blowing it off. Even if they were trying to sweep it under the rug and save the business, I would expect at least more appearance of due diligence and mailing out responses, etc.

Someone who has contacted compliance several times isn't necessarily just going to go away. If nothing else, the firm would be laying the groundwork to show they thoroughly investigated it and found nothing wrong. Or they investigated it and tried to rectify the problem.

But again, we are only getting the OP's version and what little information he is willing to share with us.

 

[Life Hawk]

But again, we are only getting the OP's version and what little information he is willing to share with us.

That is my concern. And I think more concerning what they are not willing to share. When I have push back on a question I ask in the field... red flags start popping up. I have often told folks, If you don't trust me please don't do business with me... I don't want those types of clients.

And I sure don't want to be the agent that a client feels they need to come on the forum to get an answer!!

 

[VolAgent]

That is my concern. And I think more concerning what they are not willing to share. When I have push back on a question I ask in the field... red flags start popping up. I have often told folks, If you don't trust me please don't do business with me... I don't want those types of clients.

And I sure don't want to be the agent that a client feels they need to come on the forum to get an answer!!

Yep, experience has taught and repeatedly reinforced the lesson, when a prospect won't answer a question, move on. Clearly they don't trust you, so don't waste another second on them.

 

[DHK]

And I sure don't want to be the agent that a client feels they need to come on the forum to get an answer!!

AMEN to that! If a prospective client or actual client of mine has to ask a question on here, that client should be fired because the trust simply isn't there. By that point, generally, they would simply be too suspicious of anyone to work with anyone, in my opinion.

That being said - I try not to use the words "trust" or "honesty". My job is to demonstrate that I'm worthy of trust, that I'm honest, and that I'm competent, not talk about it. It's a subtle difference.

I'd rather say "Either my ideas make sense for you, or they don't. Either way is okay with me."

 

[Julieolo]

This is all very overwhelming for me. I realize that I don't know enough to even ask the right questions. I envy you all, your ability to wrap your head around this. It is going to take me hours upon hours to read, document and organize all my information to even begin to pull my thoughts together if I want to consult a lawyer. I am hoping that Ilya Law gets back to me with a recommendation. I have done an internet search on Annuity Lawyers but I fear I could just get myself into more of a mess by doing this.

Scagnt83, you are correct. I was talking to the Financial Planners internal Compliance person. This is what I mean when I say I have no idea what I am doing.

I called the Insurance carrier this morning and explained my situation. They transferred me over to the Escalation Dept. She did confirm that whether I take out just the interest each month or take out more, dipping into the principle that I will have to pay a 10% penalty fee.

I requested a copy of the application as you suggested. It has to be "requested"and the process will be at least 7 days.

DHK...thank you for the links and article information. It does sound like I should not have to pay 10% penalties on the principle. I guess the 72(q) sequentially equal periodic payments is what I am missing.

Life Hawk...like I said, I would love to name names here on this forum but I do not want to be liable if they accuse me of slandering their good name. Heck, I would post my contract on here for you guys to look at if I thought it would help and not put me at risk.

 

[Julieolo]

I do not want to be miss leading or leave anything out. I want good honest answers to my situation. I almost wish you would all come back and tell me that I messed up and to bad so sad. I could at least blame myself and move on.

But I am SO upset that he did not give me this information. It would have made a difference in my decision.

 

[VolAgent]

It sounds like you are making progress. That is good to hear.

Please remember, we often get asked to armchair quarterback, and we often get lied to or mislead when asked to do so. So there is definitely some suspicion when details are missing.

 

[Life Hawk]

I do not want to be miss leading or leave anything out. I want good honest answers to my situation. I almost wish you would all come back and tell me that I messed up and to bad so sad. I could at least blame myself and move on.

But I am SO upset that he did not give me this information. It would have made a difference in my decision.

Julie, if this is truely the case, I would strongly suggest that you have another agent review the suitablity portion of your application. Do this in a face to face format. And to be frank, you cannot be liable for slander by a company that you say did you wrong. You are not held to the same standard as we agents are in this case.

You still need to have this reviewed by another individual that could give you an unbiased opinion of what you have so that you can have a clear picture as to where to go next. It is my professional opnion that you might come here for help or another perspective, but you still need to sit down with someone and have them review your case. Without viewing the actual contract and applicaiton in full, I would not feel comfortable giving you much more advice then I have already. It has nothing to do with you personally, it is just bad business to discuss something in detail and give indepth advice when we don't have all the facts or paper work to review.

Depending on who the company is and how the contract is written, most companies if they or the agent made the mistake, you might be released from the contract without penalty. If this is a large company, your money is not so important to them that they would not give it up to save a legal review and a compliance complaint.

Ask another agent to review it for you... not sell you something... review it.