HSA: Assurant vs. Golden Rule

[insureman07]

Alright Lets start with the preventative benefits. #1 Assurants prices are over the top. #2 The annual exams and preventative benefits are not covered untill The Deductible and coinsurance are met. Thats at the top of page 5 on the assurant Brochure form #29233. The other benefits that stand out are very similar to Golden Rule. I'm Comparing the most comprehensive plans the Maxplan Vs the Copay Select. Time and time again the pricing is all that sets them apart Assurant being higher always. I've sold Assurant for years since the old plans were done away with. They are a good A rated company and my second choice to Golden Rule anyday unless certain conditions are present or Mayo clinic is needed. I'm still a big fan of the condition specific deductible though . I also like them for Maternity.
Golden Rule is a better priced plan and is domiciled here in the US vs Uk for Assurant. Dont get me wrong , I do sell the product in many cases.
What do you feel stands out besides the benefits offered by select solutions which add a whole lot to the already overpriced plans?
Over

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

I don't know what Assurant policy you're referrencing where preventative isn't covered until the deductible is reached. I don't know of a plan in MD where this applies. In MD the Assurant HSA and Max Plan all cover preventative from day 1 and with CoreMed it's a 6 month wait. I think you might be mis-stating the phrase "not covered." Saying that something isn't covered means no re-pricing and it doesn't court towards the deductible. This would not be the case with Max Plan.

As for HSAs - Assurant's has an immediate wellness benefit and GR's has a 3 month waiting period. Regarding more differences, that's when you have to actually read the policies for your state - the reason is the mandates. In MD Assurant has a far superior policy to GR and again, you have to compare policy to policy, not brochure to brochure.

Also, "over-priced" is a general term. In what zip code? In many zip codes Assurant matches or beat GR rates. In other's Assurant rates are so hideous I would even bother pulling up the software. Rates are also neither here nor there when underwriting comes into play.

I have recently given GR a very fair shot at a few HSA deals - all with very manageable pre-ex conditions. Out of the last 4 GR deals I put in 3 were declined. All 3 were issued by Assurant within 48 hours. None of those declines were remotely justified, in every case pre-screen lied to me and in every case their own underwriting guidelines showed that they would be accepted.

 

[somarco]

I have never understood the position some people take in flatly recommending one plan over another. Insurance is not black & white, it is always gray.

When given the opportunity, I show clients the merits of each plan they like, then we gradually discard the ones that are not a fit.

Sometimes we end up with Aetna, sometimes GR, sometimes Time.

It just depends.

Once I have the facts, I can usually find the right plan for my clients in about 10 minutes.

I do this completely without prejudice and my clients seem to appreciate the effort.

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

When it comes to clean cases the best rate wins as long as the plan is solid. GR is fantastic for those cases.

When it comes to pre-ex I don't have time for GR's bullshit and no longer recommend them or even bother showing their rates - especially when they are on meds. I have better things to do then waste my client's time by giving GR a deal with pre-ex, then everyone gets in a circle, holds hands and prays that it goes through.

Declines cause a lot of emotional pain for people and there's nothing more distressing for some people then to have a company tell them their health is "so bad" that they can't get issued. I abhor making that call. Let's also not forget that a decline has serious repercussions on obtaining future insurance. For Time's STM, for example, any recent decline makes you instantly ineligible.

GR, to me, has proven over and over that they cannot be trusted for clients who have on-going medical issues. In those cases I will always recommend Assurant and never recommend GR. They can have "Jenny, age 26" but they will never get "Mark, age 56 with high cholesterol" from me.

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

Here's an example of what I'm talking about. I have an appointment to meet with the owners of Lido's Pizza. Husband is 45 with HBP, wife is healthy, six year old daughter is healthy. Currently paying $687/mo with Kaiser and they all simply hate Kaiser and the rate.

Assurant's HSA with the 25% rate-up for the HBP is $352. GR's HSA comes in at $230 - however, my client and GR will never see those rates or that deal. My client saves a significant amount of money, gets a superior plan and we don't have to mess around with GR's BS regarding HBP on one med.

 

[arnguy]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I knew that the colonoscopy at ages 37 and 42 would be "a fly in the ointment." Routine colonoscopy exams are recommended for persons 50 years old and older----those younger age exams are definitely a red flag. At this point in time, I am considering presenting him with a one-person group plan from Keystone (part of BX) because it is GI and is less expensive than the Aetna plan. In addition, the benefits with Keystone are more generous----they afford less exposure.

 

[insureman07]

I don't know what Assurant policy you're referrencing where preventative isn't covered until the deductible is reached. I don't know of a plan in MD where this applies. In MD the Assurant HSA and Max Plan all cover preventative from day 1 and with CoreMed it's a 6 month wait. I think you might be mis-stating the phrase "not covered." Saying that something isn't covered means no re-pricing and it doesn't court towards the deductible. This would not be the case with Max Plan.

As for HSAs - Assurant's has an immediate wellness benefit and GR's has a 3 month waiting period. Regarding more differences, that's when you have to actually read the policies for your state - the reason is the mandates. In MD Assurant has a far superior policy to GR and again, you have to compare policy to policy, not brochure to brochure.

Also, "over-priced" is a general term. In what zip code? In many zip codes Assurant matches or beat GR rates. In other's Assurant rates are so hideous I would even bother pulling up the software. Rates are also neither here nor there when underwriting comes into play.

I have recently given GR a very fair shot at a few HSA deals - all with very manageable pre-ex conditions. Out of the last 4 GR deals I put in 3 were declined. All 3 were issued by Assurant within 48 hours. None of those declines were remotely justified, in every case pre-screen lied to me and in every case their own underwriting guidelines showed that they would be accepted.

Wow its been awhile, I was referring to the brochure here in Az. It states at the top of the brochure that preventative benefits are 'subject to deductible and coinsurance in the maxplan. Meaning they are covered after the deductible is paid of course. This in comparison with GR copay select where preventative is covered yet limited to $300yr but covered. Oh by the way when you question my interpretation of the word covered I wonder. Why would you hide behind the literature or brochure or semantics of the industry. When something is covered My clients expect it to be paid for. Benefit equals paid for equals covered.This is not pissing contest I work for Assurant And GR and Im merely looking for another BROKERS opinion. I came in here and asked you to elaborate on your very empty claims that ASSURANT is better. I just wondered if you could back that up. Your response was to read the brochure. Dont be a fool I am a broker just like you I understand these plans and have sold them for over 5 years. So I'll just end this one with Wow it looks like the preventative benefits are different in your state . I could see why you would sell it if its less expensive and covers your clients preventative concerns. Here the policy covers us much less. But I agree your field underwriting must be very good in order to get business issued at times with GR.

 

[CHUMPS FROM OXFORD]

"preventative benefits are 'subject to deductible and coinsurance in the maxplan"

That's surprising. In Ohio...and I assumed everywhere else, it is not subject to the deductible.

 

[J.R.]

The deductible and coinsurance applies only if the office visit option is not selected OR if the client obtains lab work outside of the doctors office.

One of the main gripes I have with a lot of the carriers literature is the lack of examples provided in their literature about how benefits are paid. GR recently edited their brochures to get rid of the annoying 10,000/20% OOP confusion after many agents complained and now it;s in plain language. Perhaps if enough agents voice their concerns about the lack of clarity in their brochures we can get some things changed again and carriers would have a simple ABC methodology to give examples in the brochures about sample claims. Otherwise, it is up to us to bring that to our clients attention.

 

[TXINSURANCE]

GR recently edited their brochures to get rid of the annoying 10,000/20% OOP confusion after many agents complained and now it

I believe Norvax is still showing this incorrectly, not sure - but yes this didn't make a lot of sense - I can also point out 50 other examples from 20 other carriers.

Truth be told unless plans were standardized A-Z like med supps (not suggesting this is a good idea), this will never get much better - consumers have NO clue what they are buying (as a whole), and for the most part neither do agents (who are chasing commissions).

All carriers play underwriting games and blocking games - there is no "better" policy out there since it is so subjective and situation specific.

All you can do is sell reputable large companies and pray to God they pay the claim, and don't block your customer out after 3-10 years (which they likely will...)

Personally I don't think the price break for H S A is anywhere near where it should be, and people are conditioned to co-pays, two big hurdles selling H S A 's particularly over the phone / internet where the client base is transitional, younger, and less affluent as a whole.