Inflation Protection or Bigger Daily Benefit

[Newby]

What seems to be missing in all of these posts (unless I've missed one) is the fact that this should be a family discussion (if there are family members stil alive), even if the family members live 4 states away.

I only have 5 LTC plans in force. All 5 prospects included their adult children in our meetings, either by teleconference or in person. All 5 completed a detailed fact finder, including financial information, in front of the adult children. All 5 completed the application in front of the adult children. All 5 have given a copy of their application and policy to an adult child.

It is not for me, an outsider, to speak to how much time each adult child, can or cannot spend, taking care of Mom or Dad. It's not up to me to tell them where they can and cannot receive care. This means that, if their adult child lives in another state, chances are that the care, beyond home health care, MIGHT be done in that state. So, therefore, you need to research numbers in that state, as well as the home state of the prospect.

If a prospect does not want their children involved in our talks, I send them to somewhere else. I also make them sign a "release" form, stating that I won't work with them, and for that reason. It prevents a future E&O claim from the kids.

You will find that, if you include the family in every step, these questions will be answered.

YMMV

I don't see that as being the best approach with most families.

"Yeah Mom, you better double up on that LTC insurance because I'm not moving back home to take care of you."

Do you see a lot of kids who are against their parents insuring themselves? Do you think the kids are comfortable telling their parents they need it. Do you think most parents think their kids are smarter then them (ever heard of the diaper effect?)

Parents of the age who buy long term care don't usually rely on their kids to make decisions like this for them. Many don't even want their input until they have made their decision.

I agree that it is good to bring up the idea of including the children...but to insist on it is VERY unrealistic.

Just my opinion...other side of the coin.

 

[Frank Stastny]

I don't see that as being the best approach with most families.

"Yeah Mom, you better double up on that LTC insurance because I'm not moving back home to take care of you."

Do you see a lot of kids who are against their parents insuring themselves? Do you think the kids are comfortable telling their parents they need it. Do you think most parents think their kids are smarter then them (ever heard of the diaper effect?)

Parents of the age who buy long term care don't usually rely on their kids to make decisions like this for them. Many don't even want their input until they have made their decision.

I totally agree with Newby. Everyone I have talked to initially said, "My children love me, they would never send me to a nursing home". WRONG!

My pat answer is, "I love my children, I would never expect them to destroy their quality of life having to feed me and change my diapers".

In my experience, most children who "love their parents" are not going to "push" for then to take "Nursing Home Coverage", this is what we are talking about! Not all of the rest of the BS that agents sell to boost their commission.

Look at the ADL's. They are the same for residental care as they are for nursing home coverage. Do you really think that if a person cannot transfer that home health care is going to be an option? I hardly think so.[/quote]

You can tell them all sorts of things but it boils down to, if the parent cannot feed them selves, transfer or dress themselves they are going to need care 24-7.

Does one really want to lay that on their children? I know I wouldn't!

LTCi is designed to protect assets. If they don't have assets then there is Medicaid.

After you have been in the LTCi market I think you will re-evaluate your approach to a more realistic one.

I'm sure you think and believe that you are providing a valuable service but it is not a realistic one.

I start with the basic policy that pays for nursing hom coverage only at a reasonable daily benefit. For younger people I recommend inflation protection compounded annually.

For the "older ones", I suggest a larger daily benefit to cover inflation.

I also ask if they think they need a policy that will pay the full cost of nursing home care or if they have sufficient assest to pay a portion of it them selves.

Spend some time in this market and I think you will have a totally different perspective.

I agree that it is good to bring up the idea of including the children...but to insist on it is VERY unrealistic.

Just my opinion...other side of the coin

 

[James]

Two things I hear more and more, I want to stay at home as long as I can, and will this cover Assisted Living at a Nursing Home? Nursing home only coverage is bare essentials, I don't know of a family that would want to send Ma or Pa to a Nursing home if limited care too one degree or another is needed or if they could afford to go to the Assisted Living side of a NH.

 

[Frank Stastny]

Two things I hear more and more, I want to stay at home as long as I can, and will this cover Assisted Living at a Nursing Home? Nursing home only coverage is bare essentials, I don't know of a family that would want to send Ma or Pa to a Nursing home if limited care too one degree or another is needed or if they could afford to go to the Assisted Living side of a NH.

Most "limited care" can be done at home with someone looking in on the person a couple of times a day. Why should your prospect pay through butt for that kind of service? Because the agent makes a greater amount of commission? I don't think so.

I start with the basic Nursing Home policy and then show them the options available. If they want to add those that is their choice. I do not recommend that they start with a policy that is going to make me the most commission!

With all the policies I have seen, Assisted Living is not adequate for someone who cannot meet the ADL's like transfering and feeding.

Assisted living is not going to provide those services. Typically they will do laundry, fix meals and some of the other mundane services. But, they will not be there 24-7 if the persons needs to wet.

They have to face the realities. If the agent is not helping them do that they they are doing a great dis-service by pretending that they can either stay at home or live in an "assisted living facility". All that agent is doing, then the agent is only looking the increase their commission.

 

[James]

Some sell to the "Need" some sell to the "Want", since both live off of the commission for one to call the other "Whorish" is like "the Kettle calling the Pot Black".

Home care is for the most part very desirable any way you look at it. If the person doesn't want to burden their children with 6-18 or more hours of custodial care daily (which at times children can not do, due to physical, emotional or time restraints) than under the Nursing Only theory they have no choice, yet most want a choice. As far as Assisted Living Facilities, please try to keep up with the times!

Once agian though, it all depends upon the Affordability of the person buying that will outweigh all other concerns.

 

[LTCiPro]

Yeah, I'm trying to persuade her on a four year plan, but she is dead set on lifetime. Her family history is pretty clean - no alzheimers, parkinsons or cippling arthritis. So I figure a lifetime plan is overkill.

Everything I could find research wise said Texas nursing home costs are at $55000 per year on average. $45000 for in home care. Math it out to get $150/day.

Forget the avg NH cost for the entire state, get the actual for her own specific COUNTY. Call 3-5 NH's in her couty and ask. May well be lower than you think and that's likely to be where she go if needed facility care. I also disagree that her good health is a reason for shorter benefit period. Her good healt may very well be what keeps her alive longer in a care setting, whether it's home, asst living or NH. Stronger bodies hang around far longer than frail ones...especially since they respond better to current technology in care.

If she really wants Lifetime, give to her and minimize the whistle and bell riders and any fluff benefits. Give her strong coverage and I would recommend 5% Simple Inflation.

ltcipro