Tree contractor gone crazy

[DanteX]

I had a large tree branch fall on my garage and called different contractors to come out and give quotes while also starting an insurance claim. One contractor never showed up so I got a different tree service company on the phone and he was able to come out that day. He said he works directly with the insurance company and said he could take the branch off the same day. He did 3hrs of work by himself and got the branch removed. It was a good job but he was very strange with the discussion afterwards about trying to get as much money from the insurance company as possible, etc.. talking very erratic. he left and the tree branch and assorted wood on our lawn and said he would be back within 5 days to pick it up.

My insurance company got back to me with an adjuster coming out and determined tree needs to be removed and we also had roofing damage. They cut us a check and sent it out. The tree guy we hired to cut branch off our garage doesn't take out full trees and we were so off put by his earlier conversations.. I asked him for a quote/estimate/receipt for the 3hrs of work he did plus the clearing of the branch which he had not done yet so I could cut him a check myself since my insurance paid me out and I will be needing to get a different tree guy and roofer now.

Long story short, the guy won't give me a receipt or any estimate and says he wants to invoice and talk to the insurance directly to get the most money. He said on phone he deserves 5k+ and is on our side.. but always goes thru insurance. Very eccentric guy.. I told him we are going to terminate with him picking up the branch because he won't supply any paperwork and is making my family nervous.

He tells me to not interfere with his insurance claim which he will be doing next week and that If I do he will sue me. He has mentioned many times he wants to make the insurance company pay and pay. I offered to pay him twice the average rate of 3hrs of tree work. Average rate in our area is $200 an hour.. I offered him $1200.... he laughed. He has sued/been sued a total of 53 times in 13 years. Lost most of the cases but won some smaller judgments according to court records. I think his plan is to send in an inflated invoice to insurance to get paid.. no way 3hrs of work warrants 5k with not even removing the tree.

How would you guys continue with this situation? Would you call and insurance adjuster and let them know what he is planning on doing or just let him do it? I still have to deal with two other contracting companies for payment. Thanks for advice.

 

[adjusterjack]

He said he works directly with the insurance company

Well, you probably couldn't have known this then but any contractor who says that is likely a crook and should be immediately and unequivocally sent down the road.

For future reference adjusters don't "work with" contractors. We don't hire them. We aren't your negotiators. When a contractor calls about getting paid we refer him right back to the homeowner who hired him.

That's why homeowners have to be damned careful when dealing with contractors. Get written estimates up front. If they don't look kosher, submit them to your adjuster. He'll know if the contractor is in the ballpark or gouging. If the estimate looks OK get a signed contract for the work at that price. Pay the contractor on completion of the work. Pay by check so your cancelled check is your receipt if the contractor won't mark the contract paid in full, which is what a reputable contractor would do.

Would you call and insurance adjuster and let them know what he is planning on doing

Yes. Absolutely. And do it in writing along with (hopefully) photos of the tree on the house so the adjuster can figure out what the removal should have cost.

If the contractor does call the adjuster I hope the adjuster will tell him where to stick his $5000 invoice.


As for his threat of a lawsuit, probably hot air.

 

[DanteX]

Well, you probably couldn't have known this then but any contractor who says that is likely a crook and should be immediately and unequivocally sent down the road.

For future reference adjusters don't "work with" contractors. We don't hire them. We aren't your negotiators. When a contractor calls about getting paid we refer him right back to the homeowner who hired him.

That's why homeowners have to be damned careful when dealing with contractors. Get written estimates up front. If they don't look kosher, submit them to your adjuster. He'll know if the contractor is in the ballpark or gouging. If the estimate looks OK get a signed contract for the work at that price. Pay the contractor on completion of the work. Pay by check so your cancelled check is your receipt if the contractor won't mark the contract paid in full, which is what a reputable contractor would do.



Yes. Absolutely. And do it in writing along with (hopefully) photos of the tree on the house so the adjuster can figure out what the removal should have cost.

If the contractor does call the adjuster I hope the adjuster will tell him where to stick his $5000 invoice.


As for his threat of a lawsuit, probably hot air.

Thank you for the response. With regards to not getting a written estimate.. what would be the best course of action in regard to a possible small claims lawsuit from him? I have tons of pictures and will likely follow up with insurance company. Can we use the estimator from the insurance company as a solid quote to use in court if it goes down that road. I can't really get quotes now since the branch is down but I could ask companies what they would of charged but I don't know how much standing that would have. I thought a $1,200 offer was more than fair for 3hrs of work by himself. Thanks again

 

[adjusterjack]

Michigan small claims limit is $6500, lawyers are not allowed, and the rules of procedure and evidence are somewhat relaxed.

You can use the adjuster's estimate if the removal from the roof is itemized. It would be a good idea to get estimates from other tree removers based on the photos. The best evidence, of course, is to have one of those tree removers testify in court as to the cost of 3 hours worth of work. Make sure you ask them if they'd be willing to testify. If not, all you can do is go with what you've got and hope for the best. Keep in mind, however, that you allowed this contractor to work without having any idea what he was going to charge. That puts you in a weak position to argue about his charges after the fact. Again, if you get sued, all you can do is present the best defense that you can and hope for the best.

That he's lost most of his lawsuits is a good sign though you can't use any of that in court.

Post a photo of the tree on the roof if you like and indicate what kind of equipment was used for removal.

 

[InsCommentary]

Always get an estimate from a contractor in advance and in writing. Too late now, but now you know. Talk to your insurer…they are used to dealing with frauds. There may be regulatory issues.

 

[adjusterjack]

There may be regulatory issues.

Good point. He may be skirting licensing laws.

 

[DanteX]

I have attached 3 pictures of how it looked before he did the work and 3 pictures after. It was just him who used a harness and chainsaw and was at our house for 3 hours total which included setting up. He did not remove the brush as part of the 3hrs. He told me over and over again this is a $4k plus job and he has invoiced insurances many times and never been denied.

 

[InsCommentary]

My residence was hit by a tornado in 2013 and I had 19 cedar and hackberry trees felled. To take them all down, remove them, grind the stumps, and regrade and reseed the backyard, it cost $6,000 and took one day literally from dawn to dusk. Admittedly nothing had to be removed from a structure, but some of these trees were 40’ tall.

 

[adjusterjack]

Did he cut the limb at the tree and let the whole thing roll to the ground where he then cut it into smaller pieces? If yes, then $1200 is more than generous without removal of the debris.

Show the "before" photo to other tree companies and get prices in writing for the same service without removal. Get two or three if you can. If they come in close to the $1200 that you offered, send him copies along with a check for $1200. Always pay the undisputed amount. If you pay nothing the contractor keeps hounding you and will win any lawsuit because you do owe him something. When you pay the undisputed amount with evidence that the amount is in line with other contractors, the burden is on him to prove any additional charges or walk away with what he's got.

If you want the branches removed (and not kept for firewood) you can probably hire a 20 yard dumpster for a few hundred dollars, throw the branches in the dumpster, and off it goes.

This is no $4000+ job by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[DanteX]

Adjusterjack..he cut the limb at the tree and left the brush in the ground. He did not cut the branches into smaller pieces.

I had a a lawn service guy come out and clear all the debris for $200.

I have had two other tree companies come out to give estimates on the tree removal and both said if they were to charge for the job he did.. it would of been $1000. Both said they couldn't put it in writing since job was already done so I got three more companies lined up for estimates.

They also said he did a pretty bad job because sawdust was left on roof and he used spikes to climb the oak tree which is a big no no. Both companies mentioned it without me even asking.