Two Year Point 2 Point VS. 1 Year?? Thoughts Please

[0b1kanobee]

Yeah, I noticed that thread but I couldn't make sense out of it (not your fault).

I'm going to print this out and keep a copy with me so I can get the pros and cons to it. Thanks for the explanation.

 

[scagnt83]

Yeah, I noticed that thread but I couldn't make sense out of it (not your fault).

I'm going to print this out and keep a copy with me so I can get the pros and cons to it. Thanks for the explanation.

I have a client that it seems this product would be perfect for; but I just cant get comfortable with it. If it was a yearly P2P I think I would be all over it; but with monthly averaging idk..

 

[ScottLFB]

No.

ING, LSW, JN, Great American, Symetra

I use Great American the most right now because it is a great company for one but at the moment nobody out there can touch their income rider most of the time depending on client's age and a couple of other factors. I know this because I have a couple of FMOs I can talk to and have them run the numbers. Lately, nobody can touch it.[/quote]


If your FMOs are only running illustrations on those carriers you have listed above, you should start asking more questions.. "Nobody can touch Great American's rider?" 10% Simple Rollup for 10yrs isn't hard to beat and maybe we should talk if those are your only options.. They are a great company and we use them as well but do you want the highest payout for your client or just listen to what your GA tells you?

 

[0b1kanobee]

No.

ING, LSW, JN, Great American, Symetra

If your FMOs are only running illustrations on those carriers you have listed above, you should start asking more questions.. "Nobody can touch Great American's rider?" 10% Simple Rollup for 10yrs isn't hard to beat and maybe we should talk if those are your only options.. They are a great company and we use them as well but do you want the highest payout for your client or just listen to what your GA tells you?

No, the ones listed above are the ones I write (ING, LSW, JN, Great American, Symetra). I'm a free agent.....has nothing to do with a GA. I was looking for something better for a client. Seeing who is offering just what right now. Remember (unless you don't know) that it is just not the 10% you have to beat. You also have to beat the % at age payout.

I had this run:
500k taking guaranteed income at year 5 and Great American came back at $40,500 per year for life on a 59 y.o. single annuitant. (no joint life)

The carriers used against Great American from this particular source were:
Allianz
American Equity
American National
Aviva
Equitrust
Forethought Life
Guarantee Income Life Insurance Company
ING
Legacy Marketing Group
Lincoln Benefit Group
National Western Life
North American for Life & Health (NACOLAH)
Old Mutual (OMFN)
Phoenix Life
Royal Bank of Canada (RBC)
Sagicor Life
State Life
Sun Life

Do you know of an A rated company who can beat that right now?

He ran those for me and told me to stick with the Great American. Just an FMO looking to get some business and they help me out from time to time with spread sheets when it comes to laddering. I have been trying to write a ticket for them because they have helped me from time to time over the years with different ideas and tricky situations.

Also,do you have any thoughts on the one year vs. the 2 year PTP you might like to share which was the title of the thread?

 

[padthaiforlunch]

So is the Great American income rollup 10% compound interest or simple interest?

 

[0b1kanobee]

So is the Great American income rollup 10% compound interest or simple interest?

Simple Interest. But if you Google, you can find the calculator online and see the payouts at age and put the amounts in. I'll see if I can post the calculator below in a link. You have to scroll down and on right side, click calculator under "training materials".

GAFRI Single Source : IncomeSustainer Plus

I'm still waiting for somebody to step up to the plate and show me an A rated carrier who can provide my client (based on the info in post #24) with a better lifetime payment. No takers I guess.

 

[scagnt83]

I'm still waiting for somebody to step up to the plate and show me an A rated carrier who can provide my client (based on the info in post #24) with a better lifetime payment. No takers I guess.

Without the calculator I can tell you that you are basically talking about an 8% (compounding) rollup w/ a 6% payout.

Strong numbers, and could very possibly be the best fixed option.

But since you are just selling riders and not the underlying product, why not go with a VA... im pretty sure there are better options with JN & Pru... or at least the same; considering the chance of outperforming the rollup while still retaining the same guarantees, there is not much reason not to.

If the client does not like that option, they probably are not 100% set on using the income rider; that means that you need to be worried about the underlying product and the performance of it.... & that means that the option in question very well might not be the best option....

And if you went with LFG, while you might have a slightly lower rollup than Pru or JN, but the stepups in income you are more likely to receive with LFG could create a higher income on down the road.... either way you go about it, on selling riders alone, VAs are the way to go.

 

[0b1kanobee]

But since you are just selling riders and not the underlying product, why not go with a VA... im pretty sure there are better options with JN & Pru.


Also, will they allow him to start income in only year 5??

Well that is the strategy we like. We really want to put somewhere around 200k to 250k into a VA and the other (1/2 or so give or take) into the FIA. The V/A product is JN.

No, the client could start income in year one but I don't see that happening. The product comes with a 2 YR. ROP so this particular person would just pull his $$$. There is quite a bit of n/q $$$ too going into some manged accounts.

We want the FIA to sit there and percolate and the V/A to hopefully get some really nice gains. Basically it goes back to the old theory of not having all your money in one basket. The V/A needs to be in their for inflation, growth and those RMDs that come down the road. Well it doesn't 'have to be' but it just makes the most sense and has potential.

But yes there will be a V/A. One of the nice things about having a securities guy for a partner on the annuity business or anyone for that matter wanting to go into that investment spectrum. If it was just me I would lose the client for sure because there just isn't enough sizzle in the FIA for some making more of a lateral move.

 

[padthaiforlunch]

Using the Rule of 72, we can determine the the comparable roll-up rate is 7.2%.

Example: Client puts in $100k. Roll-up is $10k year. Takes 10 years to double money. Ergo: 7.2%.

Are the payout percentages guaranteed in the contract?

 

[scagnt83]

OB1,
You didnt get my point, if he is actually using the riders, the VA is a better option and just as guaranteed.

JN has better subaccount options than others, so it makes sense to use it for growth; but that doesnt mean that another VA might not be a good fit for the guarantees

If its NQ, that would make a much larger case for LFGs I-for-life rider... especially over the IA

Not only would it be a better option for the client, but you would get paid more too