Uh-oh....

[Guest]

You'll probably care when you need a surgical procedure, but can't get it because there's a massive waiting list....yeah.

Nope. We'll end up with a two-tier sytem, like the UK, so that those who can afford it can go to a private hospital.

Al

 

[djs]

People don't want to spend $12,000 a year for health insurance. If the government can get them the same coverage for $5000 in additional taxes, that is where they are going to go.

And how does that happen?

This is the problem with the debate... or lack thereof. Nobody defines the problem, yet they all have fixes for it.

I don't know anyone who is thrilled with the current system, or at least, doesn't think it could be better. So lets change it.... but shouldn't we say what we want to change? And maybe even why?

If I can get the same coverage for $5,000 instead of $12,000, I'm in. But will it be the same? Will I have a choice? Can I opt out? Hmmm, a good debate would be helpful. Those moving forward are doing all they can to not have a discussion or even say what problem they want to fix.

Do we fix:
- Undocumented workers (commonly referred to as illegal aliens) abusing the sytem? Should we put a bandage on them and send them home?
- The high pay of doctors?
- Medicare paying so little that the PPO plans are billed extra to make up the shortage?
- The fact hospitals have to treat people, regardless of whether they get paid? Again, people with PPO plans have to make up the difference.
- Mandated coverage? If so, are there provisions to opt out? There are for required auto coverage.
- Do we charge obese people more? How about some personal responsibility?

and the list goes on and on...

Define the problem you want solved, have a debate, solve the problem, move forward. Don't skip the first step though.

Dan

 

[Winter_123]

Nope. We'll end up with a two-tier sytem, like the UK, so that those who can afford it can go to a private hospital.

Al

Well, that is not exactly untrue. It is usually the case in socialist systems that those who propose the perfect solution for "the people" prefer a different solution for themselves.

Michael Moore and Fidel Castro will tout the glory of the Cuban medical system. However, do you think that when either one them needs medical care they are sharing a bed with someone else as they do in Cuba as needed to hold costs down. I read the other day that an increasing number of female Cuban doctors are working as hookers to compensate for their low pay/no pay. I dont doubt that Michael Moore and Fidel may use Cuban hookers but probably their doctor is paid a little more.

 

[cmsplert]

I think the problem many of you are having is that you honestly believe that the world revolves around YOU and because of that you have zero concept how much people truly hate the current IFP system of coverage where the carriers get to cherry pick for healthy 30 year olds and leave the rest of the working population to either die or pay through the ass for coverage.

Most of you are young and stupid. You think the current system it terrific because you can make a six figure income from it... on the backs of those who work a lot longer and harder for their money than you do.

You and NAHU and the carriers have had everyone by the balls for many years, and your arrogance and conceit have paved the way for the huge resentment that is now being manifest in Washington, DC.

I honestly don't believe you can beat this one... like you did in 1993. I liken this to the culmination of the civil rights struggle... when the country finally turned against segregation and separate-but-(un)equal and we saw pubic accommodations and voting rights legislation that basically ended the apartheid South.

My advice is to learn how to sell life, DI, CI, and LTC.

The government is going to run their own plan, like they do Medicare and no one is going to cry any tears for Wellpoint, UHC, the Blues, Aetna, or any/all agents.

It's the market at work. You f--k people over long enough and eventually they will find a substitute for whatever it is you are selling them. That's what is happening here. People don't want to spend $12,000 a year for health insurance. If the government can get them the same coverage for $5000 in additional taxes, that is where they are going to go.

You can moan and groan about it until the moon turns blue, but not you, not Ron Paul, not Rush Limbaugh, not Newt Gingrich is going to be able to stop it. Any agent who honestly believes that the current system is the best of all possible systems and who thinks he/she will be selling this HDHP managed care health crap two years from now... simply does not get it... and in my mind deserves to be put out of business.

How many friends does that make me in this venue. Not many? I'm fine with that. I'm on the side of the hard working citizens of this counry... not you and your greedy insurance carriers. You don't like that? Ask me if I care!

Al
Preserve your memories

My wife would have died in Canada. But in the US of A she was able to obtain the most advanced diagnostic testing even after all previous minimal invasive testing provided negative. The final test was open lung biopsy.

Bronchitis for months.

CATSCAN showed infiltrates

Long needle – negative

Bronchoscope - negative.

Doctor bet his house she did not have cancer and suggested she had sarcoidosis and that steroids would treat her fine.But just in case he suggested an open lung biopsy. Which that greedy Blue Cross of California approved with out a second thought.

Canada she would still be waiting for the CAT SCAN and after the long needle proved negative she would have been on steroids waiting for another year or more for a approved CT as her tumors reached 5mm size and larger.

Is our system more expensive? You are God damn right it is not. What is expensive is my son and daughter without their mom. Price that out jacka$$.

Stage IV with an atypical presentation is a mother killer in socialized medicine counties.

Go f--k yourself jackass...

BTW, Bush 1 wanted to fix the portability issue and the Donkey's blocked him becuase they did not want piece meal reform they wanted a complete take over. So they threw millions of Americas under the bus for their power grap. They deserve a very slow diagnosis of stage IV C but they will not - we will.

 

[Corporate Death]

I truly wish that there was a website, broadcast, or SOMEthing that could be spread around that included hundreds of Canadians and Britons giving their examples of why America should not go to a socialized medical care system.

This is yet one more example added to my list of medical care horrors to the north.

My wife would have died in Canada. But in the US of A she was able to obtain the most advanced diagnostic testing even after all previous minimal invasive testing provided negative. The final test was open lung biopsy.

Bronchitis for months.

CATSCAN showed infiltrates

Long needle – negative

Bronchoscope - negative.

Doctor bet his house she did not have cancer and suggested she had sarcoidosis and that steroids would treat her fine.But just in case he suggested an open lung biopsy. Which that greedy Blue Cross of California approved with out a second thought.

Canada she would still be waiting for the CAT SCAN and after the long needle proved negative she would have been on steroids waiting for another year or more for a approved CT as her tumors reached 5mm size and larger.

Is our system more expensive? You are God damn right it is not. What is expensive is my son and daughter without their mom. Price that out jacka$$.

Stage IV with an atypical presentation is a mother killer in socialized medicine counties.

Go f--k yourself jackass...

BTW, Bush 1 wanted to fix the portability issue and the Donkey's blocked him becuase they did not want piece meal reform they wanted a complete take over. So they threw millions of Americas under the bus for their power grap. They deserve a very slow diagnosis of stage IV C but they will not - we will.

 

[Guest]

Is our system more expensive? You are God damn right it is not. What is expensive is my son and daughter without their mom. Price that out jacka$$.


Go f--k yourself jackass...

I'm glad your wife didn't die. I really am. But from what I've read here and from what I can glean about your character, had I been your wife I'm sure I would have WANTED to!

We are going to have major change in our health finance system and all of you right-wing whack-jobs are not going to be able to stop it from happening. I'm not sure how that will affect the health delivery system, but I will agree with your implication that by opening the system to everyone it will dilute resources away from the few wealthy enough (like you) who can afford it now.

If you can't deal with the change that is coming, might I most emphatically suggest that you move to a major industrial or post industrial nation that does not have socialized medicine. Where might that be? I can't think of one. So I guess it will be some third world destination for you. I hear Chad and Botswana are nice this time of year.

Don't let the Statue of Liberty kick you in the ass when leaving the USA.

Write when you get work.

 

[Corporate Death]

Just curious Al,

Can you name me one program that the government started to solve a problem that actually worked? Do you believe they will make it work? Cause it seems to me that when you take money away from the equation (in other words, potential profits), you are also taking away the motivation to run an Insurance Co or become a Dr.

So, what happens when the Ins companies dry up and go away? Are we going to force people to become Doctors then? (I dont believe there are enough altruistic people in the country to want to become Doctors out of the kindness of their hearts).

 

[HealthGuy]

To all who post and question the logic of AL3: Remember, Al is smarter than everybody else, and better. Liberal supremest. According to Al, if you sell HDHP you are just F#$KING your clients. I must be F#$KING myself then because I have my own HDHP and love it, as do 90% of those clients who buy them. You can't tell him anything. Healthcare is a civil right in Als world and he doesn't care if the government F#$KS you with their version of it. Pelosi is going to ram it up your A#$ and ALs bent over and ready to receive it.

 

[GreenSky]

Nope. We'll end up with a two-tier sytem, like the UK, so that those who can afford it can go to a private hospital.

Al

How wonderful it must be to have money and be able to afford to have quality medical care. I'm surprised that you Al, of all people, would suggest that the less fortunate should have a lower level of care while to "rich" can go to a private hospital. Which will you choose for you and your wife?

Like most liberals (and conservatives), you are a hypocrite.

Rick

 

[cmsplert]

I'm glad your wife didn't die. I really am. But from what I've read here and from what I can glean about your character, had I been your wife I'm sure I would have WANTED to!

Wanted to leave her kids? Nice...That is the caring value of the Donkey. She is my wife jackass. Her and my kids mother.

We are going to have major change in our health finance system and all of you right-wing whack-jobs are not going to be able to stop it from happening. I'm not sure how that will affect the health delivery system, but I will agree with your implication that by opening the system to everyone it will dilute resources away from the few wealthy enough (like you) who can afford it now.

Not sure how it will affect the delivery. Well that was an easy out. The few wealthy? You mean 250 million Americans. Most of the uninsured are illegal aliens.

If you can't deal with the change that is coming, might I most emphatically suggest that you move to a major industrial or post industrial nation that does not have socialized medicine. Where might that be? I can't think of one. So I guess it will be some third world destination for you. I hear Chad and Botswana are nice this time of year.

You first. You for to England and at the airport say hello to mother who are coming to America to get pre natal testing.

Don't let the Statue of Liberty kick you in the ass when leaving the USA.

Write when you get work.[/quote]

Troll...

Should health care be fixed. Yes…but making it a government run program is not the answer? What is next we have to buy our food from the government?