Underwriting taking forever

[Rob Lion]

Term life for a mid-60 year old. Underwriting is taking too long. It's been 2.5 months and was just asked for more info yesterday.

Every few weeks or even a month later, they want something else - more medical records, another APS, etc.

Why doesn't the underwriter just ask for all the doctors the client has seen in the past 5 years and then request an APS and all medical records the FIRST time he looks at the file?

Why is this process so inefficient and illogical?

I know underwriting would be faster for a younger person with no blemishes in their health records, but damn... this is getting ridiculous.

I now understand why people love Final Expense; for the speed of it. And why they stay away from fully underwritten life insurance for older people.

Are you new to term lol? I always tell clients it can take anywhere from 28 days to 3 months depending on the carrier. What probably happened is they pulled records and saw other things in the records from another doctor and needed to pull records from them.

 

[rousemark]

From the FE side of things had a client 2 days ago that only had "2" meds... did a POS interview with the carrier and Nitro was one of many of the undisclosed meds. I think my eyes about popped out of my head and rolled across the table when POS agent mentioned it. Needless to say we shut that interview down in a hurry.

People only tell you what they want you to hear.

"I am in great health..have a little bit of diabetes and just a touch of heart trouble... Oh, and I am just slightly pregnant."

 

[rousemark]

"I am in great health..have a little bit of diabetes and just a touch of heart trouble... Oh, and I am just slightly pregnant."

Have to confess that I am kind of guilty of this type of thinking myself.. My wife said something about being sick and I told her,. "I,m not sick"... She just looked toward the counter where all the pill bottle are and walked on. The next week I was at the hospital with one of the church members that was having surgery. The nurse came in and was reviewing here medical history. As, she answered the questions i answered them silently for my self. Don't want to bore folks with my medical history but to make a point as to how old folks think, I will list a few items:

Nurse: Any heart or circulatory history?
Me: 5 heat attacks, quadruple by pass, stent placed when bypass closed,, leaking heart valve, mild arteriosclerosis.

Nurse: respiratory problems?
Me: COPD

Nurse: Cancer?
Me: Stage IV throat cancer, just had skin cancer removed from back and legs.

Nurse: Allergies?
Me: Several

Nurse:Glandular Problems:
Me: Hypothyroidism

Nurse: Digestive System?
Me: Ulcers, Abdominal Hernia, Barrett's Esophagus, GERD, hiatal hernia

A few more things I won't take time to list.

But if you ask me, I will tell you I am in good health. I am able to work every day. I can still drive. Go where I want. Play with my little girl and enjoy life.. I may have to make adjustments in the way I do things but life is good..

 

[VolAgent]

Why not just have a policy of...

anyone over 60, applying for life insurance, and will be fully underwritten, to list all doctors they have seen in the past 5 years, and then request medical records and APS from each doctor.​

This would save so much time.

The carrier doesn't have to do this for younger people, where the majority won't have any health issues.

So take a look at the original application, how many APSs were for doctors and facilities that were not disclosed on the initial application?

Typically, this is not an underwriting problem, it is a patient and doctor problem. The patient won't disclose, and the primary care won't pull everything into his or her own records.

As to the cost, here is how it typically goes.

Insurance company hires ABC service. ABC service charges for their service and basically gets a company card to use on the carriers service.

APS request comes in. ABC starts calling Dr.'s office for records. No one answer, no one returns message. ABC keeps calling, eventually gets Tiffany. Tiffany says that Marsha handles all requests and is only in on Tuesdays. ABC leaves a message. Tuesday comes and goes. ABC then continues to call relentlessly for records. Finally gets Marsha on the phone, she says it'll be a week and demands payment. ABC gladly pays. Marsha doesn't send records. ABC continues to call and hound Marsha until they get the records a month later.

Underwriter reviews records and sees a new specialist mentioned. Sends request for new APS to ABC.

ABC contacts specialist. After two weeks of trying to get a hold of someone, ABC finds out specialist's practice requests its own HIPAA and will not accept the carrier's. ABC gets HIPAA after a week and send off to Carrier who sends to agent, who sends to insured. Agent chases insured for a week or two for the HIPAA, sends it back.

And it goes on and on until finally all the records are gathered or the insured gives up.

And the underwriter hates it, because the case sits on their desk and makes him or her look bad. The company hates it because they are paying hundreds if not thousands for all these records, plus ABC for their time, and there is no guarantee they'll even get to issue the policy and collect premium.

 

[NewbieNewbie]

So take a look at the original application, how many APSs were for doctors and facilities that were not disclosed on the initial application?

Typically, this is not an underwriting problem, it is a patient and doctor problem. The patient won't disclose, and the primary care won't pull everything into his or her own records.

As to the cost, here is how it typically goes.

Insurance company hires ABC service. ABC service charges for their service and basically gets a company card to use on the carriers service.

APS request comes in. ABC starts calling Dr.'s office for records. No one answer, no one returns message. ABC keeps calling, eventually gets Tiffany. Tiffany says that Marsha handles all requests and is only in on Tuesdays. ABC leaves a message. Tuesday comes and goes. ABC then continues to call relentlessly for records. Finally gets Marsha on the phone, she says it'll be a week and demands payment. ABC gladly pays. Marsha doesn't send records. ABC continues to call and hound Marsha until they get the records a month later.

Underwriter reviews records and sees a new specialist mentioned. Sends request for new APS to ABC.

ABC contacts specialist. After two weeks of trying to get a hold of someone, ABC finds out specialist's practice requests its own HIPAA and will not accept the carrier's. ABC gets HIPAA after a week and send off to Carrier who sends to agent, who sends to insured. Agent chases insured for a week or two for the HIPAA, sends it back.

And it goes on and on until finally all the records are gathered or the insured gives up.

And the underwriter hates it, because the case sits on their desk and makes him or her look bad. The company hates it because they are paying hundreds if not thousands for all these records, plus ABC for their time, and there is no guarantee they'll even get to issue the policy and collect premium.

We're you just looking at my files?

 

[VolAgent]

We're you just looking at my files?

Half the files on an underwriter's desk look like this or worse. And heaven help you if the person uses the VA.

 

[bill3173]

Per page charges...carrier pays to the doctor's service (records warehousing) or the doctor's office themselves. It is supposed to defray the cost of the office (or doctor's service) providing them, and they can be upwards of 25 cents per page.

A 60 year old can have hundreds of pages of APS...even if issued standard. It can be a huge expense, and thus why we can move exams to another carrier but not the records (unless your BGA pays for them, which is unusual unless the case is huge and everyone is aware of a health condition that will require APS).

The carrier "owns" the records because they paid for them.

And sometimes the cost is so high, and their expectations are so low, they refuse to pay for them. I had a carrier a few years ago, that told me they weren't paying the $400+ bill for the records, but I could order the records and pay for them, so I did and they continued uw.

I wouldn't have done it for just anybody, the guy was an MD and had been a client for years. After three months, and every test known in the book, they approved it.

 

[NewbieNewbie]

Half the files on an underwriter's desk look like this or worse. And heaven help you if the person uses the VA.

Or Kaiser, or Tricare. This has me thinking about a new thread

 

[pfg1]

Or Kaiser, or Tricare. This has me thinking about a new thread

I had a client get his whole file from Kaiser several years ago. It was pretty easy compared to what the companies go through with them just to get a couple docs.

 

[VolAgent]

I had a client get his whole file from Kaiser several years ago. It was pretty easy compared to what the companies go through with them just to get a couple docs.

A patient has a legal right to his or her medical records. To the best of my knowledge, even with a signed HIPAA, an insurance company has no such right.

While not quite the same, I always recommend the insured hound their doctor's office too when it comes to records. Its a lot harder to tell your patient to go pound sand, that you send the records whenever you feel like it.