Agency owner is a bully

[scagnt83]

Most all of you should pat yourselves on the back. Not only is there a plethora of good advice here but the thoughtfulness and compassion just screams that you guys(all) are good people. I can't thank you enough. I'll update you when warranted.

He sells whole life insurance and that's it. As I was cleaning our garage the other day, I found notebooks of his completely filled, front and back of every page with insurance information, what to know, pitches, technical information and so on. This was all his doing. He wasn't getting any help with this. He obviously doesn't know a fraction of what most of you understand but he'll get there. He pushes himself very hard and learns quickly. He's certainly much quicker and smarter than me but he doesn't have experience which is critical.
On last thing. I question my son as to his success or lack of to make sure he's not embellishing his accomplishments. He pays his rent, pays for his car, gas, food etc. One thing I can't understand is motive. Why would an owner or someone high up in the company want to thwart anyone's success.......This is why I've asked my son time and time again about how well he's doing. By the way, my son is a 1099 and signed a contract that has 15 months left on it. He also had to sign an NDA and I believe a non-compete agreement.

Training: If he is training himself, then he should leave this position immediately in my opinion. Not a single reason for him to stay unless they are providing very high quality leads for him to make money with.

Contract: It only applies to carriers he is contracted with through the agency. Plenty of fish in the sea for him to sell. He should have zero issues leaving and selling other carriers.

NDA: Not a big deal. I doubt there is anything of importance for him to disclose.... but Ive never once been asked to sign a NDA even when working under an agency. Seems like it is a way to have something to intimidate them with if they leave.

Non-Compete: This is common. But it will be hard for them to enforce unless the scope is very narrow. The most they can do is send a cease and desist and maybe possibly get a carrier contract cancelled he had through them... but that is not likely.

Agency Owner: Lots of scumbags out there. Many insurance agencies have a bad habit of hiring literally almost anyone who is licensed and can pass the background check... give minimum training... and see who is still around in 3 years.... throw them against the wall and see who sticks.

The owner has spent VERY LITTLE money on him. Basically incorporating him into the existing overhead already being paid for. Sounds like he has invested very little time into him as well. Id guess there are 5-10 other newer agents just like him at that agency... and the owner will be perfectly fine if only 2 of them are left after 2 years. He does almost nothing and gets paid on their work for 1-2 years... then recruits a whole new batch of agents.

Its not in his interest for your son to succeed based on the set up. Once he is successful, he will have the knowledge and production status to leave... and he will. Better to have him out of the industry and make money on him in the meantime than have him become serious competition. Its a f*cked up business model morally... but not uncommon... ESPECIALLY in the final expense side of the biz.

Whole Life: Good product. Is he concentrating on the cash value aspect of it? Or is he selling Final Expense type products with very small DBs?

It is a big benefit for new agents to diversify and sell term. I wish I sold a lot more term in my younger days than I did... its inventory for future whole life sales (or IUL/GUL). Plus, there are just a lot more people out there buying term vs. WL... especially under the age of 60. You mentioned a "large policy" with a $1k premium... Im guessing he is selling final expense unless thats a monthly premium...

Final Expense is a very different niche vs. other life sales. A lot more volume is needed to survive. Often dealing with a different demographic vs. other life sales. etc. The link Newby gave would be a good thing for him to read. If he wants to focus on traditional fully underwritten life sales, then this is a good link to read: https://insurance-forums.com/community/threads/guidance-for-new-life-agents.29999/

 

[scagnt83]

In your first post, you have a link in there that says "Quote". If one clicks on that link, even though it doesn't work, you can still see where it was supposed to go to a place called n.a.a.i.p. That organization is a HUGE red flag around here. If that is who he is with, then he is with a terrible and, as far as we can see, a crooked organization.

OMG!!

If he is with n*aip... or if the agency is contracting through n*aip.... he is working with actual actual criminals. Not saying the owner is a criminal, but n*aip hacked/stole proprietary software from a forum member. I think its still being settled in court.

Not only that, but the owner of n*aip harrassed many people on this forum who were caught up in the drama. They also harassed the forum owner and got banned to the point that you cant even link to their website or type the full name on here without it being blocked out.

If n*aip is involved... RUN

 

[scagnt83]

Whst product is he selling? If umiversal life, then he is paid on tsrget premium. If he were max funding it. It would not be uncommon to be paid on just $700 of $1000 sale.

But a $1k premium for a max funded UL or WL is essentially unheard of unless its a child policy. No way its a max funded policy for CV on an adult at that low of a premium.

Sounds like he is selling FE... which means he is getting majorly screwed out of comp.

 

[RobertAAA]

Since he is 1099'd, and therefore not an "employee", I don't think the non-compete would be enforceable. I'm not even sure the contract he signed is enforceable. However, I'm not an attorney and I would advise him to ask an attorney before GETTING THE HELL OUT OF THERE!

In your first post, you have a link in there that says "Quote". If one clicks on that link, even though it doesn't work, you can still see where it was supposed to go to a place called n.a.a.i.p. That organization is a HUGE red flag around here. If that is who he is with, then he is with a terrible and, as far as we can see, a crooked organization.

 

[RobertAAA]

Thanks. I attempted to post this issue on *** but I changed my mind, copied what I wrote and posted it here.

 

[RobertAAA]

Thanks. I attempted to post this issue on *** but I changed my mind, copied what I wrote and posted it here.

He does not want to be fired. Yesterday, he was called into the office and screamed at and my son actually thought he might be hit. He was given a deadline of three more days to sell $4900 of policies I think as a sort of punishment. What brought this recent explosion is that my son was questioning why six policies he's sold over the last half year got recoded where credit goes to another agent. Boss didn't believe him and asked for proof. My son showed him text messages between my son and the him for each of these and the boss and sidekick ate a little bit of crow. That's when he was given the ultimatum to sell. My son and I were thinking the contract he signed would help him in case he got fired. Maybe not. His priorities are to stay with this company. He's terrified he'll lose this job. He's not thinking of working somewhere else, yet. I'm trying to put him on that track.

 

[scagnt83]

He does not want to be fired. Yesterday, he was called into the office and screamed at and my son actually thought he might be hit. He was given a deadline of three more days to sell $4900 of policies I think as a sort of punishment. What brought this recent explosion is that my son was questioning why six policies he's sold over the last half year got recoded where credit goes to another agent. Boss didn't believe him and asked for proof. My son showed him text messages between my son and the him for each of these and the boss and sidekick ate a little bit of crow. That's when he was given the ultimatum to sell. My son and I were thinking the contract he signed would help him in case he got fired. Maybe not. His priorities are to stay with this company. He's terrified he'll lose this job. He's not thinking of working somewhere else, yet. I'm trying to put him on that track.

He does not need to "work" for anyone but himself in this industry. Ask him what value the agency is giving him. What is his answer? An office to go to each day? Its 2022.... its been 2 months since I met a client in my office... 2 weeks since ive been into the office...

"Fired" as a 1099 agent?? LMAO.

He needs to get out of the employee mindset. As 1099, you are not an employee... you are a business owner. He is filing taxes as a business owner (schedule C).

If he was "fired" and told an ethical agency what happened, they would think bad of the former agency, not your son.

Its very possible the owner is getting kickbacks from the other agent the credits are going to.

My advice is to tell the owner to f*ck off and go to hell. Those exact words.

Being "under an agency" is useless if that agency is giving you no benefit other than their name on your business card.

He can legally operate as "Joe Smith Insurance Agent" all day long. As a Sole Proprietor (no LLC or corp) (which is what he is right now) he can create a DBA (doing business as) name for his insurance business if he doesnt want to use his name. Most states its just a form and maybe a $50 fee... and he will not need to have a separate agency license and agency contract with carriers. Many banks will even let him open a business account under the DBA.

Literally zero benefit to the agency other than a roof and sign on the door. He is young and probably thinks he needs someone elses "brand" to be credible to clients... I assure you he does not... they are buying from him, not the agency he works under.

 

[kpbdy99]

The kid's working hard and doing well, it sounds like he's got a good work ethic, he's smart, and he's feeding himself. That's a lot more than many can say. The failure rate in this biz is astronomical, so he deserves some respect. Sounds like his boss can be an ass. Well, he's in a field where you don't want to be meek, and just as with any career, you're going to encounter the occasional asshole. The good thing is that, if he can sell there, he can sell anywhere, so he needs to start building an exit strategy, and find his way into becoming his own boss. That's what's really great about this business, YOU are your most valuable business asset.

 

[WinoBlues]

Show of hands.

How many of you have a job? Work for xyz agency? Have a boss?

I have not for decades

@RobertAAA

Please read today's post with the mindset that your son is an independent agent. He does not have a J O B or the benefits of an employee.

If we all are reading this correctly your son needs to bail. You are getting responses from agents and IMOs that have been in business for 20, 30, 40+ plus years. We are competitors. However, most of us are friendly competitors that will at time refer clients to each other. We have contracts with some of IMOs here and will call out the same if warranted. We help each other regularly. Most will help a new agent readily. It really sounds like your son is in a predatory shop.

If that Dbag yelled at me or demanded I write X we would have a serious conversation. After I stopped laughing at him.

You know, that boss may be pushing the employee thing to much. May be a good time for a workers comp claim. . Kidding, kinda.

 

[Todd King]

He does not want to be fired. Yesterday, he was called into the office and screamed at and my son actually thought he might be hit. He was given a deadline of three more days to sell $4900 of policies I think as a sort of punishment. What brought this recent explosion is that my son was questioning why six policies he's sold over the last half year got recoded where credit goes to another agent. Boss didn't believe him and asked for proof. My son showed him text messages between my son and the him for each of these and the boss and sidekick ate a little bit of crow. That's when he was given the ultimatum to sell. My son and I were thinking the contract he signed would help him in case he got fired. Maybe not. His priorities are to stay with this company. He's terrified he'll lose this job. He's not thinking of working somewhere else, yet. I'm trying to put him on that track.

Actually, I think that he should want to be fired. That way, they can't hold him to any non-sensical contract that they may have and certainly can't hold him to a non-compete. As a 1099'er, he shouldn't be told what he has to do and not.

If you guys would like to talk about the situation, feel free to give me a call.