Any Feedback On The Nationwide Insurance IUL?

[jtow11]

Does anybody mind sharing some favorite carriers? Expenses are critical to long term return, would like to know carriers that believe that as well.

 

[PrivClientSG]

Ive heard the same. Some of the largest IMOs in the country have said similar comments to me when trying to pitch fee heavy (commission heavy) IUL products. Even the executives of those IMOs have said those comments to me.

I tell them they should learn the history of the product they sell.

And if I remember correctly, NA/Midland has increased expenses on a few product lines sold over the past decade. Not at the max, but increased prior to the 10y mark, not a positive sign.

Back in the 70s/80s they didnt just suddenly max out the expenses in ULs... it was gradual. Same with lowering rates, they didnt go from 11% to 3% overnight.

Steve Leimberg used to keep amazing data on companies that were -- increasing the mortality costs on their UL type products, companies that shut down and did away with certain UL type products, companies that changed age(s) requirements for certain UL type products, and so on. I used to collect and maintain a lot of that information myself, but due to many of the lawsuits we started seeing, the information became a lot harder to come by.

I was never worried about going to max overnight. I was very rarely worried about going to max over short periods of time. I was worried about the increase trending, the increases, and the closer and closer they were getting to max, sooner and sooner, and next thing you know BANG!

 

[PrivClientSG]

Very easy if the carrier has an illustration of annual costs addendum the agent can print with the illustration.

Makes sense. I've seen some of the index fees disclosed in the narrative of the illustration. But never 5% to 7%.

I am curious, if you read these illustrations, is there something in there that references an "addendum" or "additional" or some fees or whatever, that would cause you to start asking for an addendum? Is there a trigger that would get you to ask for it? Also, if they don't have it then how can you peel back the layers of the onion to get to the real fees, costs, etc.? I would have to think if they are nowhere to be found -- then they would have to be in the specimen contract. Thanks.

 

[PrivClientSG]

@jtow11 I own a couple dozen IULs. They have averaged 5% - 7% growth since purchase. sjm

Private message sent Sheryl. Thanks.

 

[Sheryl J Moore]

@PrivClientSG - the oldest IUL that I own was purchased in 2002 and the newest was purchased in 2018. I own a total of nine indexed ULs. sjm

 

[PrivClientSG]

@PrivClientSG - the oldest IUL that I own was purchased in 2002 and the newest was purchased in 2018. I own a total of nine indexed ULs. sjm

Thanks Sheryl. As I said, I sent you a private message. Can we chat? Thanks.

 

[Sheryl J Moore]

@PriveClientSG- I have never seen Leimberg's work, but I track life insurance product specifications on a guaranteed and non-guaranteed basis on Wink's LifeSpecs tool. That said, we aren't able to capture sex/age/risk class/face amount specific charges such as COIs and per thousands. Everything else is in there though, and we definitely track the changes to the products, as well as which ones are being introduced/retired. sjm

 

[PrivClientSG]

@PrivClientSG - the oldest IUL that I own was purchased in 2002 and the newest was purchased in 2018. I own a total of nine indexed ULs. sjm

Thank you very much. So you have a 20 plus year track record on one of them. Thanks again.

 

[PrivClientSG]

@PriveClientSG- I have never seen Leimberg's work, but I track life insurance product specifications on a guaranteed and non-guaranteed basis on Wink's LifeSpecs tool. That said, we aren't able to capture sex/age/risk class/face amount specific charges such as COIs and per thousands. Everything else is in there though, and we definitely track the changes to the products, as well as which ones are being introduced/retired. sjm

Steve was a legend in the life insurance business. He did work for almost every major life insurance company at one time or another. He founded NumberCruncher software, numerous other software programs, presented at Heckerling, AALU, and countless other national venues. He wrote several books, and countless articles on life insurance, and related matters. His LISI website today is the go-to for estate planning professionals worldwide. It's an incredible database of resources and information. I read it like my morning paper! LOL.

Thank you very much for the insight and background. Looking forward to talking with you!

 

[ATM]

Makes sense. I've seen some of the index fees disclosed in the narrative of the illustration. But never 5% to 7%.

I am curious, if you read these illustrations, is there something in there that references an "addendum" or "additional" or some fees or whatever, that would cause you to start asking for an addendum? Is there a trigger that would get you to ask for it? Also, if they don't have it then how can you peel back the layers of the onion to get to the real fees, costs, etc.? I would have to think if they are nowhere to be found -- then they would have to be in the specimen contract. Thanks.

Most illustration software allows you to print off the year by year expense and earnings report. I just looked at one from Nationwide a few days ago, don't know if it is selected separately from the base illustration but it's called the 'Annual Cost Summary".

It list yearly premium, premium load, policy fee, per 1000 expense, COIs, Rider charges, Interest credits and cash value and death benefit. I think there are only a handful of companies that don't make that available.