Do FIA's really average 10-12% or is that pie in the sky

[AnnuityGuy63]

I look at illustrations all day long and see past performance of products from American Equities Asset shield w Enhancements... they're best index has a 20 year average return of 10+ %/ Athene BCA Citi Grandmaster flash index 20 year return shows as over 12% average...

Here's my question, why is my competition telling my clients that they will never perform past 4-6 %?

 

[Tahoe Ray]

I look at illustrations all day long and see past performance of products from American Equities Asset shield w Enhancements... they're best index has a 20 year average return of 10+ %/ Athene BCA Citi Grandmaster flash index 20 year return shows as over 12% average...

Here's my question, why is my competition telling my clients that they will never perform past 4-6 %?

Because 4-6% is reasonable whereas 10+ is not.

If you want those returns, invest in the stock market.

Indexed annuities will perform (historically) 2-300bps ahead of the 10-year treasury. MYGAs less, variables more.

Look where interest rates and volatility were and where they are today. That will give you a solid roadmap.

Plus, most of those indices are backdated, hindsight 20/20, fiction...fwiw.

 

[AnnuityGuy63]

My clients that last year got 18.42% with PAC Life S+P index,
and Athene BNP, AI, and BOFA averaged 13%.
Were these fictitious returns? These were real returns not backdated.

 

[DHK]

Averaging those returns? Long term? I wouldn't go that far.

Can they earn those returns? Certainly not using the S&P 500 index segment.

I'm certainly no expert in all the various index segments out there. Sheryl J. Moore recently posted last month on LinkedIn that there are over 140 indexes out there for fixed indexed contracts.

One day, I'll study it out more.

Today... is not that day.

I do wish that fixed indexed insurance contracts would stay simple, but once you have one company with 3 indexes, the competitor will come out with 6 "to be better".

It is what it is these days.

I do like some of what Stan "The Annuity Man" writes about annuities. He doesn't sell them for what they might do, but for what they will do.

 

[Tahoe Ray]

My clients that last year got 18.42% with PAC Life S+P index,
and Athene BNP, AI, and BOFA averaged 13%.
Were these fictitious returns? These were real returns not backdated.

Sure. I had similar returns in one of the best p2p years we've seen in a while (depending on the timing of those annuities).

They will NOT average that over a 10+ year period, I can promise you that.

4-5% is a really safe place to land in today's interest rate/volatility environment.

If your clients end up with more, great! I just wouldn't position an FIA for accumulation anywhere near how they currently illustrate.

You're asking for some hard conversations down the road in my opinion if you do.

 

[CALTCAgent]

I look at illustrations all day long and see past performance of products from American Equities Asset shield w Enhancements... they're best index has a 20 year average return of 10+ %/ Athene BCA Citi Grandmaster flash index 20 year return shows as over 12% average...

I believe the illustrations show a Best, Average and Worst market case scenario. Maybe someone can articulate this a bit more. Are these returns you are speaking of the Best case scenario or just the average ?

Here's my question, why is my competition telling my clients that they will never perform past 4-6 %?

Who is the competition that is saying this ? That could be accurate if they add over a decent period of time.

 

[AZSHIS]

Send "Brett Kitchen" $5000 a month and he will give you the leads of people who respond to the ads he creates stating 11 to 14 percent return on annuities.

 

[scagnt83]

I believe the illustrations show a Best, Average and Worst market case scenario. Maybe someone can articulate this a bit more. Are these returns you are speaking of the Best case scenario or just the average ?

They do. And I only know of 1 product right now that is illustrating anywhere close to the 10% level on the best scenario.

FIA returns are all about timing. A 1 month difference can mean a 2% difference in return for that year.

 

[scagnt83]

Send "Brett Kitchen" $5000 a month and he will give you the leads of people who respond to the ads he creates stating 11 to 14 percent return on annuities.

And they better send another $5k to an attorney for retainer fees for when they get sued by the clients and fined by the regulators! lol

 

[AnnuityGuy63]

And they better send another $5k to an attorney for retainer fees for when they get sued by the clients and fined by the regulators! lol

I used both Kitchen leads for quite a while..I'm not on his program any longer only because I prefer F2F appointments not phone appointments but just to be fair to Brett his radio add doesn't say a specific number he does say the possibility of double digit returns...but he's talking about using IUL's, which any good ETF for that matter has performed so the S+P indexes using in IUL's has also performed... I have clients in the Symetra, Pac Life and Accordia Life IUL's and all of their S+P indexes have performed...

sorry to not be a debbie downer on Brett... his $5k per month did get me 25-30 people a month on the phone but I'm a better Jerry MaGuire _coffee table closer than an over the phone guy and as for that people are meeting in person again so no problems there either.

I as for the best, most recent and worst... even the AE worst with their SG market nad Crdit Suisse are showing worst case over 9% for the last 20 years....

The BCA- Citi Bank GrandMaster Flash and the Funkadelics shows 12.45% average the past 20 years.... and to be honest with cleitns I prefer to show a 20 year average than expect the past 10 year highs to repeat... at least not for the next couple years with Russia attacking Ukraine and the Nasdaq down almost 14%, and the DOW and S+P down almost 8%.

It might be a good MYGA season or just getting in with indexes going down when everythign comes back the clients could have some great returns in 2-3 years.... who knows.