Final Expense: Foresters Vs RNA?

[Newby]

I had a lady throw her Foresters certificate away because she decided not to accept it when it was issued.
I spoke to her again and saved the deal so all we need now is a duplicate certificate.
Foresters tells me they won't print duplicates. If someone ever loses their original they are SOL.

 

[jdeasy]

"they are too unpredicable on drafting"

Do you mean that they somehow mess-up with the insured's EFT?

"their communications with the agent is unreliable."

Is this particularly vital info. between application & issue or ?

The issue on drafting usually comes when someone changes their draft date or chamges banks. Foresters claims to not get the the new PAC form or fails to record the change. Even when I have the fax receipt that shows they got it.

I can see this happening with any company sometimes, it's happened with Foresters on every change.

On the communications, they will send you an email saying they didn't receive your application from when a PHI was done. Even though you have faxed it to them and have a receipt. They will say they are going to cut off your writing number until you get it done. So, you send it in again to keep that from happening. Then you get an email saying that you have submitted two apps on the same person and they need to clarify what's going on.

That's a mess that I don't need. They want to claim this is because the PlanRight is new and it's growing pains. Well that's BS. I have been contracted with them for almost 6 years and these problems have there the whole time.

I know of two agents that had their writing numbers suspended because of Foresters not getting the applications. These agents were not notified of a problem. They found out while in the home and trying to do the PHI. The interviewer wouldn't/couldn't proceed because of the number being blocked by Foresters. Both cases were Foresters errors and were corrected later, but, that din't do anything to fix the embarassment of the agents that it happened to.

There are too many good FE companies out there to have to deal with thi kind of garbage. If they offered something that would stand out I could see overlooking a few problems. They don't offer anything that cannot be found elsewhere.

 

[oceanofsand]

Last 2 responses are pretty convincing.
As to RNA, I read on an earlier thread about their wacko way of setting the draft date. I guess it's 10 days after the policy is issued.
That is a very big deal to typical FE seniors. If a company does not take the premium out pretty close to when it hits their account, it certainly increases the chance of an overdraft.
Assuming that RNA does not let you set up the1st draft past 30 days, how in the world do you explain an uncertain draft date or make it acceptable?

 

[TDinsgrp]

We run both and the agency does a lot of biz with both but last year my group wrote RNA the most by far! I don't "push" either one over the other but the agents seem to just like RNA. I see earlier the one complaint that IS true...if you don't understand the meds or dosage, you can be declined easily so I would say RNA...know what they like. They don't mind you calling in and asking questions about meds and dosage. Our group we provide all of that to the agents for easy reference and phone training on when not to write them.

 

[jdeasy]

Last 2 responses are pretty convincing.
As to RNA, I read on an earlier thread about their wacko way of setting the draft date. I guess it's 10 days after the policy is issued.
That is a very big deal to typical FE seniors. If a company does not take the premium out pretty close to when it hits their account, it certainly increases the chance of an overdraft.
Assuming that RNA does not let you set up the1st draft past 30 days, how in the world do you explain an uncertain draft date or make it acceptable?

RNA does allow you to set the draft date. If I write an app today and the person doesn't want to be drafted until April 3, I will put that on there. They will be be drafted on the 3rd of each month until or unless changed by the policy holder.

That 10 day issue is a bit of a pain in the ass, but it doesn't work how you described.

Say on that same application I asked for the 3rd, but for some reason they don't get the policy issued and approved until April 1. They will not do the first draft on April 3rd in that case. The first draft would 10 days from the date of issue which would be April 11 and then they would go to the 3rd for recurring drafts.

I actually like the fact that they won't draft right away. I do a lot or replacements. In a case where they would draft immediately on the 3rd, the person wouldn't have time to stop their draft from the other company.

Now, say that same policy is not issued and approved until April 5. They will not draft it until the 3rd of the following month. Which , again, is a huge help when replacing.

So, what if you are not replacing? Just call up RNA and ask to waive the 10 days and they will. Or, if you want it redated for the next month, they will do that also.

So, the 10 day thing can be a pain in the butt. It can also be a good thing. For it to be a good thing the agent has to be on top of his business all the time. I am on the website first thing everyday tracking my pending and any PAC reports. I call every client when they are approved and tell them when the first draft will be and we make any changes at that time that need to be made. I do not leave messages with the agent hotline. I will always talk to someone at RNA when a change is needed.

I used to not like their system, now I prefer it to others. I have a case right now with AmAm that was to be drafted on March 10. Is has not been issued yet. It is a replacement and the guy pays his current company on the 10th. That draft has been made for this month. If AmAm were to approve that pending policy today, they would draft tomorrow and we would have a mess. I called them to redate for April 10 and they said they would do it, but it was after much discussion and they acted like they were doing me a favor to change it.

The RNA system will get you in a bind as an agent if you do not stay on top of it. If you stay on top of it, it's a blessing.

 

[oceanofsand]

jd,

Thank you for taking the time to explain it so thoroughly. You make a convincing case.
If you ever started to recruit for FE on this forum, I'm sure you would put everyone else out of that business in a minute.
By the way: I've also experienced the same kind of hard-ass treatment from AmAm (Occidental), and I've put them way on the back burner as a result. Just don't need the extra aggravation.
Out of curiosity, I've written quite a bit of Oxford, and their interview can be painfully long and is definitely, needlessly redundant. I get the impression that Forester's may be similar. Does that sound right?

 

[jdeasy]

jd,

Thank you for taking the time to explain it so thoroughly. You make a convincing case.
If you ever started to recruit for FE on this forum, I'm sure you would put everyone else out of that business in a minute.
By the way: I've also experienced the same kind of hard-ass treatment from AmAm (Occidental), and I've put them way on the back burner as a result. Just don't need the extra aggravation.
Out of curiosity, I've written quite a bit of Oxford, and their interview can be painfully long and is definitely, needlessly redundant. I get the impression that Forester's may be similar. Does that sound right?

Can't say. I haven't written Oxford. The Foresters interview is just so long and redundant. The disclaimers are maddening. I compare them to UHL's PHI if you have ever had to do one of those.

I don't care for the AmAm PHI either. Of course they are also done by Apptical. I've never been an Apptical fan. Even when I use to write Chesapeake and they used Apptical. That "re-ask question number.." stuff is for the birds. I've never had one person answer differently on the reask. Plus it makes the agent look like an order taker or a data entry clerk instead of a professional insurance agent.

The AmCon interview take less than 5 minutes. It takes Foresters longer than that to read the disclaimers.

 

[Fisher]

It'd be cool (I think?) if AmCon was in Missouri.

 

[oceanofsand]

Unfortunately, I don't have AmCon, either.
The main Oxford disclaimer takes about 2 minutes, during which most of my clients go cross-eyed. (Try holding your breath for 2 minutes.) I doubt that 1% have any idea what it's about.
I'd say the average interview is 12 minutes. For some people that's an eternity. More than once, I've just wanted to get through it without the increasingly frustrated client breaking my phone.
Foresters sounds a lot like Oxford but with better comp.
The other day, I called RNA for general info re their available MGAs. I didn't realize that I could go direct. Is it true that an agent can often actually get a better contract by not going direct?

 

[360]

It'd be cool (I think?) if AmCon was in Missouri.

They are now in MO.