Individual Book Value

[Ann H]

This article supports my comment. No such thing as "value" in an IFP book of biz.

PPACA is always right | LifeHealthPro



Could I help? I was certain I could. All I had to do was contact customer service and get the documents necessary for a change in agent representation, have the clients fill them out and forward them to the company.

That might be good enough for the real world, but not in the realm of PPACA.

First, I was educated by the company; then, by HHS.

Insureds, once they have appointed an agent, cannot revoke that appointment unless they change their plan, and they can only change their plan at open enrollment, or if they qualify for a special enrollment period. The insurance company cannot help them; neither can I, until the next open enrollment. And while the consumers wait and stew, the dolt who dumped a bum plan on them will continue to collect his commission.

Actually, that's no purchase value in a ON-EXCHANGE book of IFP business for the reasons stated above. I would say there is some value in an OFF-Exchange book. I would agree that the ON-Exchange book is only worth the price of a hot lead. But the OFF-exchange book could be changed mid-year with an AOR.

Now, what's the value? A whole lot less than it was before 2010, when books were going for 100% of annual gross revenue or more. Now, you would have to pro-rate it to December 31st, because you could easily lose the client every January. So, for instance, if you sold the book July 1st, add up the expected revenue to 12/31/2015, and I would pay 30% to 50% of that. Grandmothered and Grandfathered plans would be worth more to me (at least here in AZ where our largest insurer is continuing them). Post 2014 plans would be worth a lot less. Exchange plans, like YAgents said, would probably be worth the price of a hot lead ($10 each).

You might get more sales value from a large agency that cross sells P&C, Life, Annuity, Pensions, etc. They might like the contact list, especially if you help transition the clients with personal introductions to the new case manager.

 

[FLM2]

Actually, that's no sales value in a ON-EXCHANGE book of IFP business for the reasons stated above. I would say there is some value in an OFF-Exchange book. I would agree that the ON-Exchange book is only worth the price of a hot lead. But the OFF-exchange book could be changed mid-year with an AOR.

Now, what's the value? A whole lot less than it was before 2010, when books were going for 100% of annual gross revenue or more. Now, you would have to pro-rate it to December 31st, because you could easily lose the client every January. So, for instance, if you sold the book July 1st, add up the expected revenue to 12/31/2015, and I would pay 30% to 50% of that. Grandmothered and Grandfathered plans would be worth more to me. Post 2014 plans would be worth a lot less. Exchange plans, like YAgents said, would probably be worth the price of a hot lead ($10 each).

You might get more sales value from a large agency that cross sells P&C, Life, Annuity, Pensions, etc. They might like the contact list, especially if you help transition the clients with personal introductions to the new case manager.

What Ann is saying in a most professional, thorough way, is that an IFP book of business has no intrinsic value to anyone but the agent who wrote it

 

[Broker22]

I read the Life Pro article carefully. I believe it may be in error. I appreciate and greatly respect Ann,yagents,somarco etc..input. A few "real world examples" > I have had agents steal my ffm on exchange clients by getting their password and taking off my npn and putting theirs on. The commission expert confirmed this has happened. Also ffm employees have told me not to have my clients call ffm unless no other way as ffm people are instructed to take off npns when working on a case. Also, a high up carrier exec told me they can change the agent by getting a B.O.R yes, I have had that happen. I had an agent run people through the exchange for me (was a close friend ) foe $50 or $75 depending on carrier. This was 6-12 months ago now he is the character stealing my policyholders by going in to their account and changing NPN, no sep . These are FACTS that I have experience I have the commission statements to prove it . So PLEASE do not tell me these things are not possible. And this is why the LifePro article is total B. S. Not attacking or meaning to offend anyones knowledge. I am just conveying my experiences. Obviously you can see why I want out of this. And I wont even begin on how the carriers are screwing me...that's another thread of woe in itself.

 

[Yagents]

I read the Life Pro article carefully. I believe it may be in error. I appreciate and greatly respect Ann,yagents,somarco etc..input. A few "real world examples" > I have had agents steal my ffm on exchange clients by getting their password and taking off my npn and putting theirs on. The commission expert confirmed this has happened. Also ffm employees have told me not to have my clients call ffm unless no other way as ffm people are instructed to take off npns when working on a case. Also, a high up carrier exec told me they can change the agent by getting a B.O.R yes, I have had that happen. I had an agent run people through the exchange for me (was a close friend ) foe $50 or $75 depending on carrier. This was 6-12 months ago now he is the character stealing my policyholders by going in to their account and changing NPN, no sep . These are FACTS that I have experience I have the commission statements to prove it . So PLEASE do not tell me these things are not possible. And this is why the LifePro article is total B. S. Not attacking or meaning to offend anyones knowledge. I am just conveying my experiences. Obviously you can see why I want out of this. And I wont even begin on how the carriers are screwing me...that's another thread of woe in itself.

In order to change an NPN mid year, there must be a valid CIC reason. If valid, and the new agent assisted, then you lose. If not valid, this is highly illegal, and these agents will eventually be caught. If the client is unaware, and policies are being reissued, it will become a problem.

MP reps stealing biz, is a whole different enchilada, and is not a blanket mandate on them, it's because the NPN is not showing up in the agent field when the CIC is done, WHEN you applied through a WBE or Carrier direct method. (the bigger problem)

This is why I have nobody assist me with my business, it is ripe to be stolen by your "assistant" when they leave your firm.

 

[Broker22]

Yagents please explain "CIC' reason. I don't know the acronym . I do believe their may be some illegality going on with this "poaching" of my clientele. And I am close with my clientele they tell me what he is doing. saying he needs their PW to upload a HHS requirement , like a tax 1040 foe example. he tells them he works for me and changes the NPN. Viola, in a month or 2 they are off my book and on his. I would like to nail this guys balls to the walls. Any ideas.

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What is "MP" rep ?

 

[FLM2]

I read the Life Pro article carefully. I believe it may be in error. I appreciate and greatly respect Ann,yagents,somarco etc..input. A few "real world examples" > I have had agents steal my ffm on exchange clients by getting their password and taking off my npn and putting theirs on. The commission expert confirmed this has happened. Also ffm employees have told me not to have my clients call ffm unless no other way as ffm people are instructed to take off npns when working on a case. Also, a high up carrier exec told me they can change the agent by getting a B.O.R yes, I have had that happen. I had an agent run people through the exchange for me (was a close friend ) foe $50 or $75 depending on carrier. This was 6-12 months ago now he is the character stealing my policyholders by going in to their account and changing NPN, no sep . These are FACTS that I have experience I have the commission statements to prove it . So PLEASE do not tell me these things are not possible. And this is why the LifePro article is total B. S. Not attacking or meaning to offend anyones knowledge. I am just conveying my experiences. Obviously you can see why I want out of this. And I wont even begin on how the carriers are screwing me...that's another thread of woe in itself.

I don't get your point at all.

You are citing reasons why business can be at risk through the Exchange and then you want someone to buy your book, that makes no sense whatsoever.

By the way, having another agent run business through the exchange and then splitting commissions is non-compliant, you could not only lose commissions but also lose your license.

If you want out of it, leave, that's your choice, it's just that no one is going to give you anything of value for your existing clients.

 

[Yagents]

Yagents please explain "CIC' reason. I don't know the acronym . I do believe their may be some illegality going on with this "poaching" of my clientele. And I am close with my clientele they tell me what he is doing. saying he needs their PW to upload a HHS requirement , like a tax 1040 foe example. he tells them he works for me and changes the NPN. Viola, in a month or 2 they are off my book and on his. I would like to nail this guys balls to the walls. Any ideas.

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What is "MP" rep ?

MP = MarketPlace Rep

CIC = Change in Circumstance or "Life Change" (LC).

If only uploading income/citizenship documents, it is done WITHOUT doing a CIC or LC, and there is no way to insert your NPN with just that uploading action only.

This scrupulous agent must do a CIC or LC, which means going through the whole application again, inserting NPN, and generating a new determination letter, and selecting a new or same insurance plan. If you have access, you can go see the date of the new determination letter. If recent, and after the original effective date, then you know how the agent is doing it.

Sometimes this generates a new policy number at the carrier, or different premium, or billing method. Depends on the carrier. Client would receive new copy of determination letter, and possibly correspondence from the carrier.

 

[Broker22]

Thanks again Yagents. So the poaching agent must be doing a new policy on them ? Not just changing NPN or he must be generating a CIC or LC as a reason to redo a policy? As far as Flm2 comment about having another agent that is certified putting a PH through the exchange and paying a flat fee as previously mentioned . I never saw where that is not legal. Many services out there do it. My self doing other products and my disdain for the exchange led me to having another agent put the PH through the exchange but it was clearly understood they are /were my clients (some with me for 20 years). My mistake for trusting a colleague to help me. They had very little on the books so decided to start stealing from me. Now I find out they are trying to cover their butts with a BOR. What a tragic end to my health side, still have many other products. I hope the Supreme Court pulls the plug on the ACA and let chips fall wherever. Thanks again YAgents

 

[FLM2]

Thanks again Yagents. So the poaching agent must be doing a new policy on them ? Not just changing NPN or he must be generating a CIC or LC as a reason to redo a policy? As far as Flm2 comment about having another agent that is certified putting a PH through the exchange and paying a flat fee as previously mentioned . I never saw where that is not legal. Many services out there do it. My self doing other products and my disdain for the exchange led me to having another agent put the PH through the exchange but it was clearly understood they are /were my clients (some with me for 20 years). My mistake for trusting a colleague to help me. They had very little on the books so decided to start stealing from me. Now I find out they are trying to cover their butts with a BOR. What a tragic end to my health side, still have many other products. I hope the Supreme Court pulls the plug on the ACA and let chips fall wherever. Thanks again YAgents

What you are saying about exchange apps makes no sense-the broker of record is the one whose NPN is attached to the application, period. They don't have to change anything to continue as broker of record, you are the one who gave the business away.

It doesn't even seem like you are certified for the Exchange, if not, you can't be a broker for any client with an Exchange plan.

And, since you are not the broker of record on these apps, how could you possibly sell the book of business.

I just don't get what your point is on this so this will be my last comment-I have a book of business with over 300 clients, each of whom is loyal to me and for whom I have done all of the work needed to not only enroll but keep them in force-I feel like my book of business has no value to anyone other than me, if you find someone dumb enough to pay you something you should take it and run like crazy.

 

[Broker22]

Flm2 I have over 20 years in this business. YAgents has been helpful.He is a pro You are like a troll that wishes to antagonize me. get a life you A$$hole. Done with you . Period.