Question for the FE Guys

[moonlightandmargaritas]

While the typical low income client might not understand insurance and cannot really comprehend the need for a large sum of money, the one thing they do understand is government benefits.

An excellent point, and one that I hadn't considered.

 

[rousemark]

I truly mean no disrespect. However, Didn't you ask what Non Fortitude options were? I will need to see this Foresters increasing death benefit whole life before I buy that.

I can think of only three situations where a person might think the cash values are added to the face amount.. One would be a UL that is written on Option B (normally not good for FE needs because it will not be guaranteed to last as long as the insured does) . The other is a Participating WL policy where the dividends are used to buy Paid Up Additions. ( Doesn't actually add the cash value to the face but would give the appearance of doing do). The third is an increasing WL similar to one we wrote in the 70s where the face increased by a simple 5% each year for 20 years resulting in the death benefit being double the original amount.( Don't know of any company that is writing the Increasing WL any more)

Based on this I would also like to see the Foresters that increases the DB. Their fully underwritten WL pays dividends but their SIWL is not expected to pay a dividend so it would not increase.

 

[WinoBlues]

I can think of only three situations where a person might think the cash values are added to the face amount.. One would be a UL that is written on Option B (normally not good for FE needs because it will not be guaranteed to last as long as the insured does) . The other is a Participating WL policy where the dividends are used to buy Paid Up Additions. ( Doesn't actually add the cash value to the face but would give the appearance of doing do). The third is an increasing WL similar to one we wrote in the 70s where the face increased by a simple 5% each year for 20 years resulting in the death benefit being double the original amount.( Don't know of any company that is writing the Increasing WL any more)

Based on this I would also like to see the Foresters that increases the DB. Their fully underwritten WL pays dividends but their SIWL is not expected to pay a dividend so it would not increase.

You and Reardon are a couple more I think Newby should interview. Along with 4 or 5 more on this forum. I think that it was M O O N that mentioned the Law of Requisite Variety.

 

[nfl72]

Foresters came out with a new SI WL policy earlier in the year. The difference between that policy and the Plan Right is the allowable ages. With the new policy you can do people from ages 0 to 50. It has a minimum face amount of $25,000. It also has a childrens rider.

The plan is called SI becaue it is not a fully underwritten product. It is very easy to qualify for.

This thread was about what a FE guy might or could do with a 24 year old female with 2 children. This was after he already wrote two FE policies on the grand parents.

24 FNT WLSI Foresters 25K = $27mo or $47mo 20pay

the childrens rider would cost about an additional $10 mo, depending on the face value.

This is a good policy to write because it is SI and they are very easy to get bought. And yes the cash value is paid in addition to the face amount on this policy.

Most FE buyers are simple people so find them a simple solution and then write the dam policy.


keep it simple stupid!!!!

 

[jdeasy]

Foresters came out with a new SI WL policy earlier in the year. The difference between that policy and the Plan Right is the allowable ages. With the new policy you can do people from ages 0 to 50. It has a minimum face amount of $25,000. It also has a childrens rider.

The plan is called SI becaue it is not a fully underwritten product. It is very easy to qualify for.

This thread was about what a FE guy might or could do with a 24 year old female with 2 children. This was after he already wrote two FE policies on the grand parents.

24 FNT WLSI Foresters 25K = $27mo or $47mo 20pay

the childrens rider would cost about an additional $10 mo, depending on the face value.

This is a good policy to write because it is SI and they are very easy to get bought. And yes the cash value is paid in addition to the face amount on this policy.

Most FE buyers are simple people so find them a simple solution and then write the dam policy.


keep it simple stupid!!!!

That same $25000 whole life would cost $16/mo with RNA. Foresters is way overpriced at $27/mo. RNA is $24/mo for the 20 pay. They are less for the 20 pay than Foresters is for the level pay.

And, again I believe you are misreading that policy from Foresters. I have that product available even though I have never written it because it is not cost competitive. I have not seen in the literature what you are claiming about the cv being added to the death benefit. I did call the Foresters agent hotline about it and was told that it was not. I still wouldn't call anything I get from them a definitive answer but you are the only one claiming that the cv is added.

If you have an example of that clause I would love to have it.

 

[Norwayguy]

Foresters came out with a new SI WL policy earlier in the year. The difference between that policy and the Plan Right is the allowable ages. With the new policy you can do people from ages 0 to 50. It has a minimum face amount of $25,000. It also has a childrens rider.

The plan is called SI becaue it is not a fully underwritten product. It is very easy to qualify for.

This thread was about what a FE guy might or could do with a 24 year old female with 2 children. This was after he already wrote two FE policies on the grand parents.

24 FNT WLSI Foresters 25K = $27mo or $47mo 20pay

the childrens rider would cost about an additional $10 mo, depending on the face value.

This is a good policy to write because it is SI and they are very easy to get bought. And yes the cash value is paid in addition to the face amount on this policy.

Most FE buyers are simple people so find them a simple solution and then write the dam policy.

keep it simple stupid!!!!

You mind posting anything from Forwarded that makes the claim the cash values get added to the death benefit on death? All I see is a simple participating wl policy that allows dividends to purchase PUA's which is not the same as saying the cash value is added to the death benefit.

I hope you are not using this terminology with clients.

Okay I see where your screwing up, the product reference sheet says death benefit is face amount plus accumulated paid up additions and dividends on deposit minus debt. That is not the same as saying the cash value is added to the death benefit.

 

[Newby]

Foresters came out with a new SI WL policy earlier in the year. The difference between that policy and the Plan Right is the allowable ages. With the new policy you can do people from ages 0 to 50. It has a minimum face amount of $25,000. It also has a childrens rider.

The plan is called SI becaue it is not a fully underwritten product. It is very easy to qualify for.

This thread was about what a FE guy might or could do with a 24 year old female with 2 children. This was after he already wrote two FE policies on the grand parents.

24 FNT WLSI Foresters 25K = $27mo or $47mo 20pay

the childrens rider would cost about an additional $10 mo, depending on the face value.

This is a good policy to write because it is SI and they are very easy to get bought. And yes the cash value is paid in addition to the face amount on this policy.

Most FE buyers are simple people so find them a simple solution and then write the dam policy.

keep it simple stupid!!!!

There is NO such thing as ANY whole life policy from any company that pays the cash value upon death in addition to the face value. I HOPE you are not telling this to consumers. This is insurance basics 101. Do NOT go through life believing this. You will disappoint a lot of people as well as eventually get sued.

That's the kind of stuff that gives all of us a bad name.

 

[nfl72]

I just got off the phone with a Foresters sales rep and we again discussed the cash value issue at length. We were comparing the differences of thier SIWL and their Plan Right policy He used an illustration to help show me the fifference between the two policies. We assumed we had a man with a $25,000 SIWL policy which he had had for about ten years. It showed a cash value of about $4,800. If the guy died at that point in time his death benefit would have been around $28,500. I aske d him where the rest of the cash value went and he stated it would be used to cover costs,

So it appears the SIWL policy is much better than the plan right in regards to cash value but technically you do not get all of the cash value in adition to the face amount upon death, You only get most of it.

In regards to your statement

"Thats the kind of stuff that gives us all a bad name."

I got news for you. Your a salesman. The rest of the world doesn't care whether your a car salesman, a mortgage broker or an insurance salesman. You already have a bad name So get off your high horse and admit to the world your nothing more than a glorified carney. The first step is to admit what you are.

 

[rousemark]

I just got off the phone with a Foresters sales rep and we again discussed the cash value issue at length. We were comparing the differences of thier SIWL and their Plan Right policy He used an illustration to help show me the fifference between the two policies. We assumed we had a man with a $25,000 SIWL policy which he had had for about ten years. It showed a cash value of about $4,800. If the guy died at that point in time his death benefit would have been around $28,500. I aske d him where the rest of the cash value went and he stated it would be used to cover costs,

So it appears the SIWL policy is much better than the plan right in regards to cash value but technically you do not get all of the cash value in adition to the face amount upon death, You only get most of it.

In regards to your statement

"Thats the kind of stuff that gives us all a bad name."

I got news for you. Your a salesman. The rest of the world doesn't care whether your a car salesman, a mortgage broker or an insurance salesman. You already have a bad name So get off your high horse and admit to the world your nothing more than a glorified carney. The first step is to admit what you are.

Still sounds as if the additional death benefit is coming from Paid Up Additions.. That would be the reason for the difference in the amounts. Perhaps the rep didn't know the difference between dividends and CV? Ask for 20 yr and 30 yr projections. If you have a policy, and if the rep is telling you the facts, there would have to be a page explaining how those "expenses" are calculated. They could not be achieved by using some random factor.

 

[Norwayguy]

I just got off the phone with a Foresters sales rep and we again discussed the cash value issue at length. We were comparing the differences of thier SIWL and their Plan Right policy He used an illustration to help show me the fifference between the two policies. We assumed we had a man with a $25,000 SIWL policy which he had had for about ten years. It showed a cash value of about $4,800. If the guy died at that point in time his death benefit would have been around $28,500. I aske d him where the rest of the cash value went and he stated it would be used to cover costs,

So it appears the SIWL policy is much better than the plan right in regards to cash value but technically you do not get all of the cash value in adition to the face amount upon death, You only get most of it.

In regards to your statement

"Thats the kind of stuff that gives us all a bad name."

I got news for you. Your a salesman. The rest of the world doesn't care whether your a car salesman, a mortgage broker or an insurance salesman. You already have a bad name So get off your high horse and admit to the world your nothing more than a glorified carney. The first step is to admit what you are.

Your previous posts where factually inaccurate. Every whole policy has guaranteed cash value, the guaranteed cash value is never added to the death benefit. This policy offers dividends those dividends can be used to buy PUAs on the policy which increases the death benefit, the only other thing that would increase the death benefit are dividends held inside the policy to accumulate interest.

The reason we need to be more precise with our words is you described a UL policy under option B when you said the cash value is added to the death benefit, to totally different products. Also you mentioned a small difference between cash and the increase in death benefit but think about if it was a much larger policy in force for a longer period of time....much larger difference.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Still sounds as if the additional death benefit is coming from Paid Up Additions.. That would be the reason for the difference in the amounts. Perhaps the rep didn't know the difference between dividends and CV? Ask for 20 yr and 30 yr projections.

Rousemark you are 100% correct the ref sheet shows the death benefit would be increased for PUAs or dividends accumulating interest (who let's dividends accumulate in this day and age)?