Sales is not a numbers game, it's a game of skill!

[Lloydlofton]

I like yours better! I guess it isn't that I'm always right, it's just that everyone else is always wrong. (ha! ha!)

 

[Guest]

So to you, struggling out on a battlefield builds confidence? I see, take a few rounds of ammo in the butt, and keep going back for more! Sounds great!

If that was logical we wouldn't see the high failure rate we currently see.

While I agree that sales skills are important my experience is you gain those skills on the field of battle. Reading a book, taking a "training" class, while helpful, do not build confidence or the experience necessary to have prior situtations to fall back on to improve your skills.

 

[Delta76]

You can sit in a classroom or training session all day, but unless you go out and use it, it won't stick. Take something from training or a book, go out and use it, get a few lumps, then come back and either keep it or lose it. There is no way someone just goes out and purchases training and then is exempt from the "law of large numbers". Just doesn't work that way in real life. The lumps are where you learn.

 

[Guest]

Well, what good would training be if you didn't use it?

Why do people enjoy these "lumps?"

Maybe I just think differently, why struggle?

If I was to interview for a job and they said just get out there and bang your head against the wall until something sticks I don't think I would take that job, but agents do that very same thing, by choice and it's supposed to be good?

You can sit in a classroom or training session all day, but unless you go out and use it, it won't stick. Take something from training or a book, go out and use it, get a few lumps, then come back and either keep it or lose it. There is no way someone just goes out and purchases training and then is exempt from the "law of large numbers". Just doesn't work that way in real life. The lumps are where you learn.

 

[Lloydlofton]

So to you, struggling out on a battlefield builds confidence? I see, take a few rounds of ammo in the butt, and keep going back for more! Sounds great!

If that was logical we wouldn't see the high failure rate we currently see.

In my experience you learn in two ways in this business, you can learn by knowledge or you can learn through wisdom.

Knowledge is learning through your own mistakes, costly and increases the learning curve, Wisdom is learning through the mistakes others, shotens the learning curve when used.

To me the "high failure" rate you mention supports the logic that it is on the battlefield that confidence is built. If all we had to do was hire a new agent, give them a phone script, some leads and say call, follow the script and make appointments would more new agens make appointments?

If all we had to do was hire new agents and demonstrate a product presentation and give them a sales presentation and they would go into homes and make sales then would more agents make it?

Or is the real problem that most new agents don't do the necessay activity so they don't make it?

Again, in my exprience, when new agents don't stay in the busienss it is not that they don't do the right things, it is not that they don't do enough things, it is usually because they don't do enough of the right things, enough of the time to experience success.

Even as smart and successful as I am sure you are, my guess is the phone script you use, the approach you use and the presentation you use is one you developed over time, one that you have "confidence" in.

So when you first sarted in the business did you make a phone call that did not turn out the way you wanted, make a presentation that did not end with a sale, did you determine what did not work and make modifications?

And if you did, when those modifications worked, did you feel better or worse about the result? If you felt better then would you say you had gained in confidence? And did this initial success help you have the confidence to try iagain? And if you did, was this in the field?

Maybe your an anomaly, you hit the street and never experienced any challanges, just had natural confidene? If so that's great for you, I did not have that in 1977 when I sarted and I have hired and trained many agents over the years who most who did not have that.

Most new agents, again in my experience, quit the business because they don't have the confidence to do the activity necessary to succeed.

Almost every manager I have worked with, hired or trained over the yeas have agreed to these numbers (perhaps others can comment on these numbers if you have been a manager), 1/3 of the agents we hire will write business no matter how much training or support they received, 1/3 will never write busienss regardless of the training or support they receive, so training and support is usually for the middle 1/3 rd of aents hired.

I have always asked a simply question to new agents and their answer over the years has led me to believe confidene is the fist thing new agents need to build...the question is do you do better when you feel better or feel bad, and do you feel better when you win or when you lose?

If you do better when you feel better and you feel better when you win then as agents gain confidence do they have a better chance of succeeding in the business or a worse chance? And is that chance based on their having gained confidence from activity?

That's all I'm saying.

Seem logical to me, but what do I know.

 

[Guest]

In my experience you learn in two ways in this business, you can learn by knowledge or you can learn through wisdom.

Knowledge is learning through your own mistakes, costly and increases the learning curve, Wisdom is learning through the mistakes others, shotens the learning curve when used.

To me the "high failure" rate you mention supports the logic that it is on the battlefield that confidence is built. If all we had to do was hire a new agent, give them a phone script, some leads and say call, follow the script and make appointments would more new agens make appointments?

If all we had to do was hire new agents and demonstrate a product presentation and give them a sales presentation and they would go into homes and make sales then would more agents make it?

Or is the real problem that most new agents don't do the necessay activity so they don't make it?

Again, in my exprience, when new agents don't stay in the busienss it is not that they don't do the right things, it is not that they don't do enough things, it is usually because they don't do enough of the right things, enough of the time to experience success.

Even as smart and successful as I am sure you are, my guess is the phone script you use, the approach you use and the presentation you use is one you developed over time, one that you have "confidence" in.

So when you first sarted in the business did you make a phone call that did not turn out the way you wanted, make a presentation that did not end with a sale, did you determine what did not work and make modifications?

And if you did, when those modifications worked, did you feel better or worse about the result? If you felt better then would you say you had gained in confidence? And did this initial success help you have the confidence to try iagain? And if you did, was this in the field?

Maybe your an anomaly, you hit the street and never experienced any challanges, just had natural confidene? If so that's great for you, I did not have that in 1977 when I sarted and I have hired and trained many agents over the years who most who did not have that.

Most new agents, again in my experience, quit the business because they don't have the confidence to do the activity necessary to succeed.

Almost every manager I have worked with, hired or trained over the yeas have agreed to these numbers (perhaps others can comment on these numbers if you have been a manager), 1/3 of the agents we hire will write business no matter how much training or support they received, 1/3 will never write busienss regardless of the training or support they receive, so training and support is usually for the middle 1/3 rd of aents hired.

I have always asked a simply question to new agents and their answer over the years has led me to believe confidene is the fist thing new agents need to build...the question is do you do better when you feel better or feel bad, and do you feel better when you win or when you lose?

If you do better when you feel better and you feel better when you win then as agents gain confidence do they have a better chance of succeeding in the business or a worse chance? And is that chance based on their having gained confidence from activity?

That's all I'm saying.

Seem logical to me, but what do I know.

Had to put my glasses on half way through that one!

 

[somarco]

Gosh Lloyd. Your 30+ years as a recruiter and trainer certainly pales compared to a national trainer with less than 5 years in the industry.

Time for you (and me) to hang up our guns and retire. There's a new kid in town.

 

[Guest]

I was trained originally at 18 years old, we had morning meetings everyday at 7:30 AM, we went over objections, role playing, product knowledge, intros, closes, button ups etc etc etc.

I then hit the streets but only when it was deemed I was ready to sell.

Coincidentally, I sold.

As a side note: When I first got into health care, I actually I didn't sell right away, because (after returning from a musical hiatus) I emulated what everyone else was doing, sending info, calling back and of course falling back. After a month of being broke I said screw this.

I then implemented what I learned originally and repeatedly utilized successfully, meaning the core skills in sales and applied it to health insurance, and oddly enough, I again sold right away.

It was not chance, but choice.

I did what works, not what didn't work.

Struggling sucks, getting tidbits of info as you go while still struggling sucks, and making no money sucks.

Just my thoughts. I do see your point though and think the post (addition) was great.

Now, I do continually look to adapt and improve as I go but without a struggle, just to continuously refine the process to perfection, LOL.

In my experience you learn in two ways in this business, you can learn by knowledge or you can learn through wisdom.

Knowledge is learning through your own mistakes, costly and increases the learning curve, Wisdom is learning through the mistakes others, shotens the learning curve when used.

To me the "high failure" rate you mention supports the logic that it is on the battlefield that confidence is built. If all we had to do was hire a new agent, give them a phone script, some leads and say call, follow the script and make appointments would more new agens make appointments?

If all we had to do was hire new agents and demonstrate a product presentation and give them a sales presentation and they would go into homes and make sales then would more agents make it?

Or is the real problem that most new agents don't do the necessay activity so they don't make it?

Again, in my exprience, when new agents don't stay in the busienss it is not that they don't do the right things, it is not that they don't do enough things, it is usually because they don't do enough of the right things, enough of the time to experience success.

Even as smart and successful as I am sure you are, my guess is the phone script you use, the approach you use and the presentation you use is one you developed over time, one that you have "confidence" in.

So when you first sarted in the business did you make a phone call that did not turn out the way you wanted, make a presentation that did not end with a sale, did you determine what did not work and make modifications?

And if you did, when those modifications worked, did you feel better or worse about the result? If you felt better then would you say you had gained in confidence? And did this initial success help you have the confidence to try iagain? And if you did, was this in the field?

Maybe your an anomaly, you hit the street and never experienced any challanges, just had natural confidene? If so that's great for you, I did not have that in 1977 when I sarted and I have hired and trained many agents over the years who most who did not have that.

Most new agents, again in my experience, quit the business because they don't have the confidence to do the activity necessary to succeed.

Almost every manager I have worked with, hired or trained over the yeas have agreed to these numbers (perhaps others can comment on these numbers if you have been a manager), 1/3 of the agents we hire will write business no matter how much training or support they received, 1/3 will never write busienss regardless of the training or support they receive, so training and support is usually for the middle 1/3 rd of aents hired.

I have always asked a simply question to new agents and their answer over the years has led me to believe confidene is the fist thing new agents need to build...the question is do you do better when you feel better or feel bad, and do you feel better when you win or when you lose?

If you do better when you feel better and you feel better when you win then as agents gain confidence do they have a better chance of succeeding in the business or a worse chance? And is that chance based on their having gained confidence from activity?

That's all I'm saying.

Seem logical to me, but what do I know.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Hey Somarco,
you're sarcasm tells a lot about you, Lloyd did none of what you do in your posts and I admire him for that. It's funny Bob, you'll read (and learn) from Gitomer, does he have any experience in this "industry?" No, therefore you're sarcasm holds no weight.

I just came across this article and I believe you'll appreciate it.

People Who Put You Down Are Hurt Themselves

The first thing to know is that a happy, self confident, person does not put others down. They might provide constructive criticism but they won’t put others down. This tells you a lot about the person who criticizes you. Some people are very negative about others because:

• they need to make themselves feel like they're in control or more powerful or to cover up their own insecurities
• they’ve experienced a trauma of their own in the past and they don’t know how to deal with the pain so they'll hurt others as a defence mechanism.

People’s tirades against you will probably reveal to you just how unhappy and disillusioned and frustrated that person is with life, and that's their problem, not yours.

Gosh Lloyd. Your 30+ years as a recruiter and trainer certainly pales compared to a national trainer with less than 5 years in the industry.

Time for you (and me) to hang up our guns and retire. There's a new kid in town.

 

[Delta76]

Well, what good would training be if you didn't use it?

Why do people enjoy these "lumps?"

Maybe I just think differently, why struggle?

Rob, I'm not trying to say I am a glutton for punishment. In fact, as you know, I believe in sales training. As one who struggled without any sort of training in the beginning, I believe having a foundation would have helped greatly. My only point is it's impossible to take everything you teach and implement it all at once. I look at my Sandler training, it was all there from the start, but it took being in the field and repetition before it actually became a part of my personality. In fact, Sandler for me, more than anything, gave me the confidence in a process that Lloyd mentioned and that's when I feel I really started succeeding.

You can help give people the confidence by training them in the beginning to give them a better chance to succeed, but you can't spare them from the law of large numbers and not grasping everything at once. That's not a shot at you, it's the same with any sort of training. However, you can give the new producer that confidence and help them avoid some pitfalls, just not all of them (which equals real money and a higher chance of success). Does that make sense?

 

[Guest]

Hey delta,
You always make sense and I know you're not one taking shots because you aren't like that. I agree with you, and I do cover a lot and if you incrementally implement it, you will incrementally see a return. To do it all at once can be crazy, it can be pulled off but nothing replaces time/experience.

Rob, I'm not trying to say I am a glutton for punishment. In fact, as you know, I believe in sales training. As one who struggled without any sort of training in the beginning, I believe having a foundation would have helped greatly. My only point is it's impossible to take everything you teach and implement it all at once. I look at my Sandler training, it was all there from the start, but it took being in the field and repetition before it actually became a part of my personality. In fact, Sandler for me, more than anything, gave me the confidence in a process that Lloyd mentioned and that's when I feel I really started succeeding.

You can help give people the confidence by training them in the beginning to give them a better chance to succeed, but you can't spare them from the law of large numbers and not grasping everything at once. That's not a shot at you, it's the same with any sort of training. However, you can give the new producer that confidence and help them avoid some pitfalls, just not all of them (which equals real money and a higher chance of success). Does that make sense?