SEC says FIA's are securities!!

[Crabcake Johnny]

If we're going to agree that this industry has a lot of cleaning up to do we're fine. Asking insurance carriers to police themselves is a bit like putting a fox in charge of the hen house.

I'm not saying that health insurance doesn't have major problems - but don't ignore that the annuity biz also has very major problems.

All I'm saying is when seniors are involved, problems come into the limelight the the carriers need to be extra vigilant.

 

[senior-advisor-indiana]

Can you answer the question John? Where is that annuity you were bashing?

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

Already posted it in my list of articles - read. Not only did I post it already I was also being general - people on their 70's and 80's being sold annuities that don't mature until they're 100+ years old. Totally inappropriate sale hence the flurry of lawsuits.

Also, you are completely missing my point - which is that the insurance industry knows they are in the spotlight and you'd think they simply tighten things up and put some internal controls in place. Guess not and they're about to watch it all get turned over to more regulation.

Very short-sighted.

And instead of trying to call me out - why don't you do a bit of research:

http://www.fowlerwhite.com/docs/SeibelActArticle2.pdf

 

[sman]

Already posted it in my list of articles - read. Not only did I post it already I was also being general - people on their 70's and 80's being sold annuities that don't mature until they're 100+ years old.

Sorry John. But that just isn't true. As I mentioned before, the maturity date of an annuity isn't necessarily the surrender charge period nor is it a time in which the annuitant has no access to their money. With most annuities, the annuitant has access to 10% of their annuity value every year during the surrender charge period. You are doing nothing but fanning the flames by making statements like you do.

I agree that there are areas that could be improved upon. But let's be honest here, ANY industry where there is a commission to be made on the sale of a product or service is bound to have unethical people. The insurance industry isn't any different.

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

Wow...and you still don't get it. In Maryland, why are the penalties doubled for crimes against senior citizens? Grab the purse of a 25 year old and maybe it's a year. Grab the purse of a senior and it's 2.

Can you explain if that's fair? Are you starting to get my point? There's a difference between selling a Right Start PPO and "screwing" someone and "screwing" a senior.

That you don't understand the difference....I just can't help you. Read the above attached PDF from Florida.

Do you see FL trying to introduce legislation to stop the Right Start or Copay Saver plans?

Don't you see that selling a $600,000 annuity to someone in their 80's that doesn't mature for 15 years is gonna get special attention?

 

[URDRWHO]

Don't get yourself all tangled up in political aspirations of some politicos, as it seems you have done.

The maturity date is the longest one can keep annuity interest deferred before it must be taken out. The maturity date is not how long you must keep an annuity. It is how long the insurer will let you keep your money with them. The owner may take their money out or annuities the contract prior to the maturity date. As a licensed agent you should already know the above.

If you have an extra $250 for a book, I suggest you grab, Tax Planning for Family Wealth Transfers. You will find over 1,000 pages of information that may help you. There are many,many reasons for some seniors to have annuities.

I know several "seniors" which I am one of them at some restaurants, that have annuities. Annuities that are set up and the person doesn't expect to touch the money. They have several hundred thousand dollars placed in them, I didn't sell them the annuities. I would surmise that during these times, they are very grateful to have money in the annuities and not mutual funds. Compounding within an annuity is not counted toward the Social Security taxable income threshold.

If you saw the Dateline show I'm sure you heard the SEC person state that you don't lose money for early withdraw in a CD. Oddly enough if you go to the SEC web page Certificates of Deposit: Tips for Investors YOu will find what the representative said is not always true "if you cash in your CD before maturity and whether you risk losing any portion of your principal." Of course we all know that we should set-up programs to avoid probate. Don't we all know that? The public sure doesn't know it. In this case an annuity will by default in most all States bypass probate.

So you have people in power making false claims, claims that would get you and I in hot water. Why is that? Who is behind all the intense, misleading claims against annuities? I think once you investigate you will begin to understand the power struggle. The true money grab is at the hands of those paying PAC money to the Reps. They want the annuity business to fall under their umbrella and not insurance agents.

What makes you think that FINRA & the SEC are better at consumer protection than the State Department of Insurance? I think most of the mind shattering economic fiasco's have come from the hands of Wall Street. You think making an FIA the privilege of only Wall Street will change the bad apples? Come on now....I have a bridge to sell you.

If someone is in such a position that they desperately need the money then they should do nothing but leave it in their their bank savings account.

Remember it was also the same government that back in the 1980's put many innocent day care center people's lives in jeopardy. Years later it came out that it was all a sham, testimony's were rigged and it was basically a witch hunt. Government can often be like a rabid dog, not know what or why it is reacting as it does.

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Wow...and you still don't get it. In Maryland, why are the penalties doubled for crimes against senior citizens? Grab the purse of a 25 year old and maybe it's a year. Grab the purse of a senior and it's 2.

Can you explain if that's fair? Are you starting to get my point? There's a difference between selling a Right Start PPO and "screwing" someone and "screwing" a senior.

That you don't understand the difference....I just can't help you. Read the above attached PDF from Florida.

Do you see FL trying to introduce legislation to stop the Right Start or Copay Saver plans?

Don't you see that selling a $600,000 annuity to someone in their 80's that doesn't mature for 15 years is gonna get special attention?

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

You're all mis-reading what I'm saying.

I agree with all of you. 100% agree.

However, they are looking for ammo and the life carriers are happy to provide the ammo needed.

The heat is on and I think a savvy move for the life carriers would be to add an extra layer of protection to the equation to make sure the sale is a proper fit...especially when red flares should go off - 82 year old putting in $600,000 with 15 years.....

Would that be a huge pain? Sure. This is a case of a very SMALL percentage of agents gearing up to ruin it for everyone.

The carriers can - at will - ferret out those unethical agents. They can monitor the training the agents receive - spot check applications.

But I'm in full agreement that the securities industry is losing business and trying to re-write the rules. DON'T GIVE THEM THE AMMO THEY NEED!

 

[xrac]

Wow...and you still don't get it. In Maryland, why are the penalties doubled for crimes against senior citizens? Grab the purse of a 25 year old and maybe it's a year. Grab the purse of a senior and it's 2.

Can you explain if that's fair? Are you starting to get my point? There's a difference between selling a Right Start PPO and "screwing" someone and "screwing" a senior.

That you don't understand the difference....I just can't help you. Read the above attached PDF from Florida.

Do you see FL trying to introduce legislation to stop the Right Start or Copay Saver plans?

Don't you see that selling a $600,000 annuity to someone in their 80's that doesn't mature for 15 years is gonna get special attention?

It should get special attention but it may not necessarily be unsuitable because of the age of the senior. It all depend upon the individual situation and the annuity.

 

[Mr. Bill]

Oh heck, let's just get rid of the health care agents and let every senior fend for themselves with respect to Medicare!!!

Yeah, baby!

 

[bobson]

Wow...and you still don't get it. In Maryland, why are the penalties doubled for crimes against senior citizens? Grab the purse of a 25 year old and maybe it's a year. Grab the purse of a senior and it's 2.

Can you explain if that's fair? Are you starting to get my point? There's a difference between selling a Right Start PPO and "screwing" someone and "screwing" a senior.

That you don't understand the difference....I just can't help you. Read the above attached PDF from Florida.

Do you see FL trying to introduce legislation to stop the Right Start or Copay Saver plans?

Why doesn't the government just sell these products directly to consumers and get agents out completely because surely we can't be trusted? And clearly the government does no wrong.

Any time a government tries to ban a product for sale, you generally hurt the people that need the product the most.

There is nothing wrong with a Right Start plan per se. To sell it as a major medical plan is what is wrong. If someone doesn't feel they need full major medical insurance, who are we to dictate to them what they can and cannot buy? IF someone cannot afford a major med plan but likes the benefits of a "Right Start" plan, who are we to tell them they can't have it? State colleges in my state force students to enroll in their "health insurance" if they cannot prove they have private health insurance. Guess what the college plan looks like? Remember these are state schools that are requiring the students to buy these plans.

I don't know what percentage of people ever run out of benefit with Right Start but I would venture to say it is very, very small. Do some people? Sure. But some people also run out of benefit when they have a $2,000,000 limit or a $6,000,000 limit. Is it the government's job to make sure we buy what you feel is enough insurance?

The state requires we buy liability insurance to drive. Do you also suggest we require everyone that drives to buy a $1,000,000 umbrella because "you never know" or even a $5,000,000 umbrella because that is how much health insurance you think they need? Do you understand what percentage of drivers buy $25,000 worth of liability insurance? And the vast majority of those people will never have a claim in excess of $25,000.