The Dismantling of ObamaCare - Ongoing Updates.

[kgmom219]

Letting people go without insurance is not the right thing to do.

Its not the right path morally. People will die. This isn't hyperbole.

Its not the right path if the GOP wants to hold the House and Senate at midterms.

I will not cheer the collapse of flawed legislation that will cause Americans to suffer.

 

[scagnt83]

Letting people go without insurance is not the right thing to do.

Its not the right path morally. People will die. This isn't hyperbole.

Its not the right path if the GOP wants to hold the House and Senate at midterms.

I will not cheer the collapse of flawed legislation that will cause Americans to suffer.

Ditto. What no-one seems to care about here is other Americans ... other people ... other human beings. Its all about personal agendas and biases.

Keeping Obamacare will cause people to die unnecessarily.
Letting Obamacare die will cause people to die unnecessarily.
The RyanPlan would have caused people to die unnecessarily.

yeah I know... Life is hard and then you Die. But does a civilized society really allow their own people to suffer and die needlessly?

Nobody gives a S H I T about anyone else.. only their "agenda" and proving their agenda is "right" and the others are "wrong".

----------

A doctor I know wrote this response on a public consumer forum when someone posited essentially the same idea.



Don't confuse the ER with real medical care.

Think the ER can treat a ureteral stone? All it can do is give you some pain pills. A urologist has no obligation to remove your stone unless you can pay for his/her services.

Look at this article from the UK:

"The operation costs £2,500 privately, £1,200 or less on the NHS if done as day surgery."

Private surgery? Now why would you pay twice as much for private surgery when the UK offers universal healthcare?

All depends on how long you want to wait.

You are arguing two different points here.

Concerning ER care. Of course its not real medical care. THATS THE PROBLEM. And no, Im not saying it should be real medical care.

The problems is that 30% of the US is using the ER for real medical care.... and its paid for via taxes.

Treating people at the ER is 3x more expensive than at a normal doctor. Plus the care is worse.

So forget the moral aspect of any of it. Just from a financial standpoint, it would be MUCH cheaper as a society to pay for a primary care visit vs. an ER visit.


Concerning universal coverage. Holding up one model and saying it doesnt work is no solution. The right solution for the US will likely not look like models from other countries. Maybe its single payor, maybe it isnt.

But the greater point, is that taxpayers are paying for that 30% either way, no matter which point of care they access. Why not structure it in a way that is less expensive and more beneficial to the person???

----------

I had a broken hand, went into the ER when I was young and without coverage, the doc gave me a sling and some meds. I had to pay $1,200 out of pocket for everything.

ER doesn't cover ****

But you have means to pay and dont want a hit on your credit. The people who use the ER for primary type care do not pay their bills. They let it hit their credit report instead. Then the hospital charges more and gets tax subsidies to help offset the loss.

 

[Yagents]

I guess those who can't afford full ACA premiums, and decided to go uninsured will die instead, and end up in the ER on taxpayer dime (or lose everything they have). But that's ok, 100 clients are proud owners of a crappy STM plan due to ACA fail.

I like the universal CAT plan option & Collins/Casady bill:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapo...universal-catastrophic-coverage/#35535cc7193e

 

[kgmom219]

I guess those who can't afford full ACA premiums, and decided to go uninsured will die instead, and end up in the ER on taxpayer dime (or lose everything they have). But that's ok, 100 clients are proud owners of a crappy STM plan due to ACA fail.

I like the universal CAT plan option & Collins/Casady bill:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapo...universal-catastrophic-coverage/#35535cc7193e

The Collins/Casady bill is a great piece of legislation. The point is that Collins/Casady is doing SOMETHING.

Cheering on the demise of ACA while doing NOTHING is what I have an issue with.

 

[junkman]

I guess those who can't afford full ACA premiums, and decided to go uninsured will die instead, and end up in the ER on taxpayer dime (or lose everything they have). But that's ok, 100 clients are proud owners of a crappy STM plan due to ACA fail.

I like the universal CAT plan option & Collins/Casady bill:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapo...universal-catastrophic-coverage/#35535cc7193e

I have the worst insurance I've had in 30 years because of ACA premiums. Before ACA, I had worked the system and forced a group which only goes back 5 yrs for underwriting questions.

I'm fine with a system that forces everyone to have coverage or be able to write a check for their claims. Perhaps an escrow account funded to $1,000,000 is sufficient. (I know, bonds/insurance bla bla but was making a point that most don't have enough to self-insure.)

I attribute the high ACA premiums to low participation and resulting high utilization. Any replacement should require participation and payment. Then we'd still have the problem of never ending trend and RX issues addressed in another thread. We're screwed as far as having coverage available at least for the next couple of years.

I note that street commission is 25% for UHC's STM. That shows you many claim dollars they plan to pay. I wonder how much commission is available in bonuses and over rides? I haven't had much with UHC for years. BCBST has been eating UHC for lunch.

 

[bluemarlin08]

What no-one seems to care about here is other Americans ... other people ... other human beings. Its all about personal agendas and biases.

I call bovine scatology on that statement. You have no clue what we care about, how insulting.

 

[somarco]

You are arguing two different points here.

Concerning ER care. Of course its not real medical care.

I was arguing nothing. Merely posted a quote and link from a doctor that posted on an insurance forum. My post was in response to the suggestion that one can get health care for free in the ER.

 

[scagnt83]

I call bovine scatology on that statement. You have no clue what we care about, how insulting.

You completely missed the point. It had nothing to do with anyone or any group of people on this forum.

If it was directed at any one single group, it would be Congress. However, it was more a statement on the general attitude right now in the US about this issue.


It's sad (or telling) that you would be so offended over a statement that was not directed at you... I did say "here"... but it seemed pretty clear that I meant the situation in general in this country. Not this forum. As long as I've been on here when have I ever said anything along those lines??

 

[bluemarlin08]

Hold on little buddy, when you are posting on a site and you reference here, one might think you were referring to here. Many of your posts are rude and condescending so that is telling.

 

[scagnt83]

I was arguing nothing. Merely posted a quote and link from a doctor that posted on an insurance forum. My post was in response to the suggestion that one can get health care for free in the ER.

The statement you posted was arguing two points.

And "healthcare" is a fairly broad term. The issue is that ER "healthcare" is not an effective or efficient way to deliver primary care to low income people. But that is what the system forces them into. And it just costs us tax payers more and more money.

----------

Hold on little buddy, when you are posting on a site and you reference here, one might think you were referring to here. Many of your posts are rude and condescending so that is telling.

I'm rude and condescending when others are that way to me. And have certainly had some heated disagreements with FE agents about various shady marketing tactics. But I've never made blanket statements accusing this entire forum of anything. Get your facts straight. You seem to be the only one having reading comprehension issues with that post. And calling me condescending names does not help your image or prove your point.