This California Law Is Ripping Away American Dreams. The Left Wants to Take It Nationwide

[DHK]

Robert Kiyosaki was a failed Amway rep who discovered selling books to a captive MLM audience was far more lucrative. The characters in his book are pure fiction. His financial background is spotty at best.

And yet, that doesn't negate the value of the financial information in his books.

 

[toolbelt]

And yet, that doesn't negate the value of the financial information in his books.

Confirmation bias allows all his fans to find what they're looking for in his books. Cognitive dissonance and the sunk cost fallacy is also a big part of it.

 

[Life Hawk]

These aren't sophisticated business people for the most part, these are people taking on extra work so they can drive a shiny convertible or buy an Iphone they think they need, or get new rims. Or need extra money because they refuse to control their spending, for whatever reason.

Right out of the birth canal you had one promise only that promise was... you will eventually die.

You didn't get the promise to be loved, liked, taken care of , an education, or really anything else for that matter. As responsibility goes, your parents where to take point on getting you ready for the real world.

Our education system is failing because we are teaching what to learn rather than teaching HOW to learn. Learning is a life long business, and those that fail to address it as they continue through life become a burden on society rather than bring value to it.

Government is not responsible for making you valuable... you are.

These are tough facts that this new breed are missing. There is philosophy in the way we live our lives. We either live by a good philosophy or a bad philosophy.

To make someone else's job, to determine your value is a very poor philosophy... what happens if they don't show up for work one day?

 

[InsuranceGuy29]

I 100% agree about what you say about businesses competing, and not needing to be micromanaged by congress. This law, however, is to protect employees that are being taken advantage of by large businesses because they want to play business person or "side hustle" when in fact they are just being underpaid and overworked employees, but not experienced or sophisticated enough to know it.

When you had jobs where your pay and benefits were cut, you were still an employee and protected by certain laws, and likely paid above minimum wage. These independent contractors are not. I've talked to these people. These aren't sophisticated business people for the most part, these are people taking on extra work so they can drive a shiny convertible or buy an Iphone they think they need, or get new rims. Or need extra money because they refuse to control their spending, for whatever reason.

I hear what you're saying, but with most things like this.....the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Rich (business-owner) people are rich for a reason....because they're intelligent. They find ways around things. It's very easy to do with a team of the best attorneys money can buy. They don't don't just sit there and go "awe shucks.....dah well."

 

[toolbelt]

Right out of the birth canal you had one promise only that promise was... you will eventually die.

You didn't get the promise to be loved, liked, taken care of , an education, or really anything else for that matter. As responsibility goes, your parents where to take point on getting you ready for the real world.

Our education system is failing because we are teaching what to learn rather than teaching HOW to learn. Learning is a life long business, and those that fail to address it as they continue through life become a burden on society rather than bring value to it.

Government is not responsible for making you valuable... you are.

These are tough facts that this new breed are missing. There is philosophy in the way we live our lives. We either live by a good philosophy or a bad philosophy.

To make someone else's job, to determine your value is a very poor philosophy... what happens if they don't show up for work one day?

I think paying taxes should come with some basic standards, otherwise it's every man for himself. Scrap insurance rules, get rid of stop signs, and who cares what they put in our food. Become 300+M individual nations rather than a country. A civilized society requires minimum standards of sorts. Survival of the fittest only works if you're the fittest.

 

[Markthebroker]

I hear what you're saying, but with most things like this.....the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Rich (business-owner) people are rich for a reason....because they're intelligent. They find ways around things. It's very easy to do with a team of the best attorneys money can buy. Don't don't just sit there and go "awe shucks.....dah well."

You know, I 100% agree with what you're saying. And, funny enough, I'm almost always the guy wanting less government, and more freedom for people. Less laws, less regulation, Etc.

This new law is directly costing me money, which is rarely something I like.

I've seen how this scenario it's trying to fix harms individuals and takes advantage of people that don't understand how to break down numbers and evaluate costs. I've seen so many people think they're being clever with their little "side hustle" when they're really being underpaid and overworked. This is one of the few times when I'm a fan of more government.

Yes, businesses will find a way to work around this, but it will result in many more people being properly protected as employees. For the most part, businesses follow laws. Overall, most businesses don't murder their competitors, employ children, or pay less than minimum wage , at least domestically. I write commercial insurance, I'm already seeing businesses start to adjust to this law.

I understand there are likely a lot of people that will disagree with me on this topic. If I hadn't personally met so many people being taken advantage of, I'd probably be on the other side of this myself..

 

[InsuranceGuy29]

Right out of the birth canal you had one promise only that promise was... you will eventually die.

You didn't get the promise to be loved, liked, taken care of , an education, or really anything else for that matter. As responsibility goes, your parents where to take point on getting you ready for the real world.

Our education system is failing because we are teaching what to learn rather than teaching HOW to learn. Learning is a life long business, and those that fail to address it as they continue through life become a burden on society rather than bring value to it.

Government is not responsible for making you valuable... you are.

These are tough facts that this new breed are missing. There is philosophy in the way we live our lives. We either live by a good philosophy or a bad philosophy.

To make someone else's job, to determine your value is a very poor philosophy... what happens if they don't show up for work one day?

Wholeheartedly agree. The attitudes of a lot of today's people are pretty disturbing. It's basically "This is all YOUR FAULT," and "You need to take care of me better." While I fully understand that there has to be a balance of good benefits and compensation in work, you are completely free to go somewhere else that gives you a better shake.

You know, I 100% agree with what you're saying. And, funny enough, I'm almost always the guy wanting less government, and more freedom for people. Less laws, less regulation, Etc.

This new law is directly costing me money, which is rarely something I like.

I've seen how this scenario it's trying to fix harms individuals and takes advantage of people that don't understand how to break down numbers and evaluate costs. I've seen so many people think they're being clever with their little "side hustle" when they're really being underpaid and overworked. This is one of the few times when I'm a fan of more government.

Yes, businesses will find a way to work around this, but it will result in many more people being properly protected as employees. For the most part, businesses follow laws. Overall, most businesses don't murder their competitors, employ children, or pay less than minimum wage , at least domestically. I write commercial insurance, I'm already seeing businesses start to adjust to this law.

I understand there are likely a lot of people that will disagree with me on this topic. If I hadn't personally met so many people being taken advantage of, I'd probably be on the other side of this myself..

Yea...the only thing that would really concern me if I was a gig worker that this new law applied to is now being under the thumb of the company as an employee. I actually worked as an Uber delivery driver, for a few months, about 6 years ago.

I was between jobs, and the best part of the job was the flexible hours, be your own boss, not being tied to a set schedule, and not being beholden to major corporations. New laws like this only make people corporate slaves. That's where most of my concern comes in.

I know a lot of gig workers actually don't want this, because the things I mentioned are what they value most, and then those benefits will all be gone. Most of these folks also already qualify for EXTREMELY low-cost (or even "free") health insurance.

After having been on the corporate plantation, and now as an Independent 10-99'er, you would have to beat me over the head, grab my hand, put a pen in it, and force me to sign paperwork to get back on the plantation. I want absolutely ZERO part of it. I don't want or need a boss. I work just fine being my own boss.

Also note that these types of gig jobs really aren't meant to be a career. They're really just for school kids, soccer moms and dads that need a little extra side money to supplement their spouses income, and older retired folks just looking for something to do. I know it's complicated, and you have a valid case for your stance on this, too, but I just think there's more drawbacks to the people that are actually doing the job.

In my eyes, this is just another power grab from the government that wants people to have less freedom, using benefit trinkets as the bait. Being on the corporate plantation is no fun, and is quite soul-crushing.

 

[Markthebroker]

Wholeheartedly agree. The attitudes of a lot of today's people are pretty disturbing. It's basically "This is all YOUR FAULT," and "You need to take care of me better." While I fully understand that there has to be a balance of good benefits and compensation in work, you are completely free to go somewhere else that gives you a better shake.


Yea...the only thing that would really concern me if I was a gig worker that this new law applied to is now being under the thumb of the company as an employee. I actually worked as an Uber delivery driver, for a few months, about 6 years.

I was between jobs, and the best part of the job was the flexible hours, be your own boss, not being tied to a set schedule, and not being beholden to major corporations. New laws like this only make people corporate slaves. That's where most of my concern comes in.

I know a lot of gig workers actually don't want this, because the things I mentioned are what they value most, and then those benefits will all be gone. Most of these folks also already qualify for EXTREMELY low-cost (or even "free") health insurance.

After having been on the corporate plantation, and now as an Independent 10-99'er, you would have to beat me over the head, grab my hand, put a pen in it, and force me to sign paperwork to get back on the plantation. I want absolutely ZERO part of it. I don't want or need a boss. I work just fine being my own boss.

Also note that these types of gig jobs really aren't meant to be a career. They're really just for school kids, soccer moms and dads that need a little extra side money to supplement their spouses income, and older retired folks just looking for something to do. I know it's complicated, and you have a valid case for your stance on this, too, but I just think there's more drawbacks to the people that are actually doing the job.

In my eyes, this is just another power grab from the government that wants people to have less freedom, using benefit trinkets as the bait. Being on the corporate plantation is no fun, and is quite soul-crushing.

You and I agree on so much here, but disagree on the bottom line. My hope is that people will take on these part-time jobs, but as employees where they are properly protected, but still have flexibility.

I am completely on board with you though, I don't like seeing government getting more control, more power, etc. My hope is this will do more good than harm, I could be wrong, this could do more harm than good.

 

[suranceman]

You know, I 100% agree with what you're saying. And, funny enough, I'm almost always the guy wanting less government, and more freedom for people. Less laws, less regulation, Etc.

This new law is directly costing me money, which is rarely something I like.

I've seen how this scenario it's trying to fix harms individuals and takes advantage of people that don't understand how to break down numbers and evaluate costs. I've seen so many people think they're being clever with their little "side hustle" when they're really being underpaid and overworked. This is one of the few times when I'm a fan of more government.

Yes, businesses will find a way to work around this, but it will result in many more people being properly protected as employees. For the most part, businesses follow laws. Overall, most businesses don't murder their competitors, employ children, or pay less than minimum wage , at least domestically. I write commercial insurance, I'm already seeing businesses start to adjust to this law.

I understand there are likely a lot of people that will disagree with me on this topic. If I hadn't personally met so many people being taken advantage of, I'd probably be on the other side of this myself..

How are they being taken advantage of.

A company offers them work. The workers willing agree to the terms of the work.

Why would we need to interfere with two consenting adults engaging in an employment arrangement they both agree to?

 

[Markthebroker]

How are they being taken advantage of.

A company offers them work. The workers willing agree to the terms of the work.

Why would we need to interfere with two consenting adults engaging in an employment arrangement they both agree to?

Well, that's just the thing. They don't really agree to the terms of the work because they don't understand them. They make much less, spend more, and work more than they understood, which is why you rarely see people drive Uber for more than a few months. And your statement "two consenting adults engaging in an employment arrangement they both agree to" is false, both because it's not an employment agreement, that's the whole issue, and because the independent contractor doesn't really agree to it - they don't even understand it.

The hope would be that the workers are better protected as employees. I've talked to a lot of people that have gig jobs, and have yet to speak to anyone that fully understands any major facet of the work they are doing or costs.