What do you look for?

[Frank Stastny]

Geez! if you have that many uplines, how do you have a drop of blood left for yourself? There shouldn't be more than 1 level between you and the company, and not even that if they will hire direct and provide support.

I looked the thread over and didn't see anyone who said they had multiple up-lines between them and the insurance company or who your comment, "if you have that many uplines" is directed to.

I agree, one should first attempt to license direct with the company. However, I'm not sure what you mean by "provide support". I get the same support from every insurance company I represent. If I have a question or problem I can call and get an answer. None of them provide sales training, leads or "hand holding" support. Just solid information if and when I need it.

 

[GreenSky]

Geez! if you have that many uplines, how do you have a drop of blood left for yourself? There shouldn't be more than 1 level between you and the company, and not even that if they will hire direct and provide support.

I was joking about the upline for PPL.

As far as the number in an upline if you can't contract direct, here's the usual:

FMO
IMO
MGA
SGA
GA
Agent

The commission paid for each level is not dependent on the number of people above you. So if the FMO gets $500 and the agent gets $250, then the FMO just kept an override of $250. Drop in a couple of other people, the FMO gets less but the agent gets the same.

The real crime is that if you contract direct with a carrier who also has FMOs, your commission (in the example above is still $250). My contract for Today's Options avoids the entire FMO system, but it's the same as what is available anywhere.

Since most of the work is done by the carrier and agent, why does the FMO get anything more than a 5% override?

Given that system sucks, there are some good FMOs who truely appreciate that WE share OUR commission (not the other way around) and at least try to add value.

Rick

 

[Frank Stastny]

Since most of the work is done by the carrier and agent, why does the FMO get anything more than a 5% override?

Given that system sucks, there are some good FMOs who truely appreciate that WE share OUR commission (not the other way around) and at least try to add value.

Rick

Personally I don't think the deserve that much. Two percent would be more than generous.

Insurance companies are to blame for the current system. They are like a lot of agents. The companies no longer want to "prospect". All they want to be involved in is the "fun part", collecting the money. They would rather add another level that is designed to screw agents out of a fair commission for the work they do than have to prospect themselves.

At some point in time they discovered that having someone else do their bidding, regardless of whether or not they were being truthful with agents, would get more agents to license with the insurance company.

If insurance companies would pay agents the full amount they pay for a new app, does anyone really think that company would have problems signing up agents? Even without being deceptive about "training" and "leads".

The FMO's, IMO's and all the others may be paying "street commission" but shouldn't the real street commission be the total of what insurance companies pay for a new app?

I'm tired of working my ass off so some guy can get rich simply because he gave me a piece of paper to sign. As I said earlier, I get more than "street level" or I take my toys and go play somewhere else.

 

[Guest]

Given that system sucks, there are some good FMOs who truely appreciate that WE share OUR commission (not the other way around) and at least try to add value.

Rick

Which ones do you like... and for what carriers?

It would be nice if some kind soul did weeks of research and put up a website that had a matrix of what different GAs and FMOs paid for different carriers/products. It we (agents) had full knowledge of how the system worked it might rock the world of the GAs and FMO.

For example I want to write two $200k policies (husband/wife) with West Coast. WC only uses GAs, not direct. The (well known and large) CPS GA offers me 65%. LifePro (smaller outfit) will offer me 75%. Who am I going to place the business with?

Hmmm. There might be enough collective knowledge here for everyone to contribute to the matrix... maybe a Google spreadsheet we could all access and make additions to? Or maybe a database where we enter the FMO or GA name and up pops the info? Just a thought.

Al

 

[GreenSky]

Which ones do you like... and for what carriers?

It would be nice if some kind soul did weeks of research and put up a website that had a matrix of what different GAs and FMOs paid for different carriers/products. It we (agents) had full knowledge of how the system worked it might rock the world of the GAs and FMO.

For example I want to write two $200k policies (husband/wife) with West Coast. WC only uses GAs, not direct. The (well known and large) CPS GA offers me 65%. LifePro (smaller outfit) will offer me 75%. Who am I going to place the business with?

Hmmm. There might be enough collective knowledge here for everyone to contribute to the matrix... maybe a Google spreadsheet we could all access and make additions to? Or maybe a database where we enter the FMO or GA name and up pops the info? Just a thought.

Al

Not everyone has the time nor the computer ability to do this. Also, since you are relatively new to the insurance industry, you many not realize that something like what you are talking about would not be passible for agents nationwide.

Not all companies are in all 50 states, commissions may vary from state to state depending on the rules and regualtions of each state's DOI, and many FMOs limit themselves to certain areas.

You might want to look into this yourself. It may help you better understand the insurance business and with your knowlege of computers you would be the most logical one to design a website that would have all that organized by state and company.

Rick

 

[Guest]

Not everyone has the time nor the computer ability to do this.

A multi-sheet spreadsheet would do the trick if you didn't want to get to complex. It might not hold all the data for all carriers for all FMOs, but it would be better than the info-base we have now!

Not all companies are in all 50 states, commissions may vary from state to state depending on the rules and regualtions of each state's DOI, and many FMOs limit themselves to certain areas.

A well-designed database could easily handle all of this. The problem is that a well-designed database takes time and money to produce. No one is going to do it for free, I don't think. That's why I thought of maybe a 'community based' spreadsheet of some kind.

You might want to look into this yourself. It may help you better understand the insurance business and with your knowlege of computers you would be the most logical one to design a website that would have all that organized by state and company.

Well, first of all, compared to software or hardware engineering, the insurance business is hardly complex. Even compared to the publishing business (which I've been in for 15 years) the business model is simple. The products are not hard to understand for the most part (except for some variable annuities that will boggle the mind), you are not involved in manufacturing like in the book biz, and you don't have to deal with a wholesale and retail distribution channel. The insurance model is kick-ass simple compared to other enterprises I've been part of. You can do it in your underwear! The hard part is not the product, it is the selling.... the prospecting, the competition, and a somewhat corrupt model where the product producers often (not always) try to screw their sales force (not unlike autos or home improvement.)

Second, yes I can spend some time putting together a database driven website but doing all the research on FMOs payments for different products in different states is the killer. It would have to be a community effort, at least on the data part.

I'll look and see if I can find a 'out of the box' database solution that will only require slight mods on my part. But the data would have to come from the community. No way would I (or anyone) do all that work for free.

However if you DID come up with something I'll bet you could sell it to Norvax or QuotIT who would use it as a 'premium' to get brokers to sign up.

Al

 

[Kimber]

Frank, it was Green Sky. Two entries above mine.

 

[retread]

Interestingly, I came across this thread while developing a spreadsheet of this data for my own business plan. It does take some time, but it has the benefit of helping to define your revenue streams.

I agree that to do this homogenously for everyone, the task would not only be time consuming, but impracticable for the cited reasons of state and carrier diversity.