Anybody out there work for New York Life?

[Winter_123]

Never ask a question that you don't know the answer to! I once asked that and Bob set me straight....Bob, you out there?

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Many A rated companies have failed. The question was in how many instances was the death benefit ultimately not paid given the fact the there is re-insurance, buy-outs and assumption of liability etc. I would like to know the anwer to that- whatever it might be.

Never asking a question you dont know the answer to may be good if you are in lawyer or sales mode 24/7. However, I am not and take in new information from time to time.

Winter

 

[MIBizInsurance]

The reason I interviewed with NYL at the beginning was for the training.

However after going through 3 interviews felt uneasy with the manager and his fuzzy math. He went on about sending out $3k worth of mailiers and how that would produce X amount of premuim. Then you re-invest, wash and repeat and with in 18 months your set. Had been in sales and marketing for many years before these interviews and knew that 1-2% is norm as far as return on mailers. Not the figures he was spewing.

There were other reasons but in end felt uneasy with the manager. He quit or was fired as a couple months later got a call from new manager asking if I was still interested. By that time was on my way in different direction.

 

[David C]

NYL

One of the most important benefits of going career company versus independent has been overlooked. The insurance business is a unique business and requires a unique skill set. It takes time to learn the intricacies of this business, it takes time before that lightbulb goes on above someone's head, and before that eureka moment when they realize what this industry is all about.

One of the most valued things in career situations is the availability of someone to hold you accountable, for someone to invest themselves in your success, and for someone to prod you on when you don't want to be prodded.

Early success is an extremely important indicator of long term success, it is too important to be left to chance.

Additionally, and my observations may be unique to my area, but, all the career agents here live in nice homes and seem to have very nice lifestyles while the independents (with two or three exceptions) seem to be marginally successful at best.

 

[Agent]

"Okay, well I was asking about products and we sort of went into a little spin zone here. Are you saying that a Genworth term or West Coast converted over to a permanent policy is not competitive with New York Life. If that is true, I am just trying to get some information. It sounds like the response is that New York Life is not competitive or have any differentiating products but that they come with the superior advice of a New York Life trained agent. If that is the explanation I am okay with it. Just trying to understand."

No spin zone Winter…I said that they’re not competitive in term. That is answering your question rather directly. Genworth has been in existence on it’s own, separate from all GE financing for how long? West Coast life was just bought out by Protective. Listing those two companies proves my point.

New York Life has good products, “competitive” with others is what I had said…did I say superior or best in the industry? No, and they are not. In most cases however, as I said, their Permanent plans are competitive. They are a permanent Insurance company first and foremost.

"I do think that the actuarial rating explanation is smokey. The potential demand on the reserves is an important factor but this is why companies have financial ratings, and those ratings reflect an assessment of those factors."

I’m sorry you think it’s “smokey”. You agree reserves are an important factor and that’s all I was saying. Look at some of the companies that have gone bankrupt and check out their *ratings* the year prior to their filing.

"Some old guard companies like Mutual of Omaha, and apparently NYL, get a lot of mileage out of playing that old card about the client wanting to make sure that the company is around to make payments if needed."

It’s probably said because it’s a legitimate point.

"All of the major competitive companies are A-rated companies. When was the last time an A-rated company failed to pay a death benefit, and if the policy comes with guaranteed rates then the rates are set. In addition, states require companies to adjust their reserves as needed, and then there are re-insurance requirements as well. Some of it is like General Motors poo pooing cheap foreign imports for years and trading off of their solid name. It works a little but not as well as it used to."

Where did I say that they have not paid claims (though I've not looked at all the data)? My point and the question that I did ask is will they always be there? Will they be there in 20, 30 or 50 years when you need them?

Your General Motors analogy flaws in comparison in many areas but most noticeably it assumes that the underlining product is flawed and all the company relies on is their solid name. This may or may not have been true with General Motors but it is not with NYL.

"Also, don't assume that an agent who gets the best quote for their client based on a full assessment of the clients needs is not building a relationship with the client and serving their larger interests. If New York Life trains its agents well, then that is good but that does not make them the only professionals in town. State Farm also touts their comprehensive approach to meeting their clients needs and their superior relationship building. While products attributes and price are not only the factors to be considered, they are important factors and I like to see what they are sometimes whether it be New York Life or State Farm."

Actually, getting the absolute best rate can be a detriment if the company overall is not the best run company etc...

There is a balance to be struck, getting the best rate that matches their pocketbook with a solid company I think is important and serves their best interest as well. My point is being a term convenience store by taking in shoppers as clients is not the best clientele building strategy.

Of course there are other professionals with other companies, which includes independent producers as well.

If you want to know what NYL products are (State Farm is proprietary through Phoenix Life) then get a brokers contract and get their literature. I don’t write their products anymore, not because they’re bad, I'm just with a different company, and I’m sure they have issued new products in the time since I was there.

Nak4Life

 

[Winter_123]

Genworth has been in existence on it’s own, separate from all GE financing for how long? West Coast life was just bought out by Protective. Listing those two companies proves my point.

Actually, getting the absolute best rate can be a detriment if the company overall is not the best run company etc...

If you want to know what NYL products are (State Farm is proprietary through Phoenix Life) then get a brokers contract and get their literature. I don’t write their products anymore, not because they’re bad, I'm just with a different company, and I’m sure they have issued new products in the time since I was there.

Nak4Life[/quote]
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Well actually I just quickly listed four companies Genworth, West Coast, Prudential, and Mutual of Omaha as part of my asking why (from a consumers point of view) New York Life is so competitive and the answer I got was that New York Life agents do well and that New York Life is a solid company compared to others. Accepting the point about Genworth which may or may not have merit. Mutual of Omaha and Prudential have rather been around for a while. West Coast Life merged with Empire General, both companies over a hundred years old. Each of those companies has alleged strongpoints at the product level regardless of whether term or permanent. Prudential often has good rates for smokers, Genworth does well with healthy, preferred. West Coast is good on price but it is alleged that its merger with Empire General allows it do better with rated cases. Without getting to whether these points are true or not true, the point is that these are the things that come up in discussion around some of these companies. I was wondering if there is anything noteworthy or competitive about New York Life products- that's all. The answer I keep getting is that New York agents do well and if I really want to know anything about the products, I can get appointed with them and get their literature and find out. Not a strong argument fo New York Life products.

You know, the broker/dealer world is also filled with companies that are not really able to articulate to the world what they actually do better other than the fact that they have been around for a long, long time, and they have high name recognition. Their ads and images are filled with hype about how they are the most solid and most caring companies in the world etc and everyone else is a fly by night shmuck who does not lie awake at night thinking about their clients as their agents all do. Consequently, investors are fleeing these companies in droves and going online or to the discount brokerages. I am not saying that this is right or wrong. I do think though that there is a trend is toward consumers looking at the real value or performance of these companies rather than just accepting the endless streams of advertisements that suggest that they are more rock solid and trustworthy and care more than the others. The consumers ands investors do know that there are many companies out there that are good for the agent and that the agent does well financially (both in the insurance and in the investment world). Whether that equates to the best arrangement for the clients is another matter.

I go back to the analogy with General Motors. You can trade off the name and the rock solid image for a long, long time and convince everybody that everything else is just a cheap foreign import and that price alone is not everything and so on and so forth. That will buy you some time. Eventually though GM ends out playing catch up to the other companies on price and performance. All I got back when asking about New York Life is that it is a great company for agents and that its strong point is that you can easily convince clients that they have been around for a long time and are likely to be around for a long time to come. Okay fine, got it. In regard to the good training at New York Life, got it. In regard to New York Life agents living the good life, got it.

Winter

 

[Guest]

In the last 50 years has any perm. insurance carrier gone under such that policy holders lost a dime in principle or interest? Have any of them closed down leaving clients uncovered (no DB)? Has there been a case where a company was in trouble and had to delay paying a DB or not paid one at all? (BTW, after company gets a death certif, how long does it take them to pay? Should be a week, but I bet they drag it out for the float.)

Al

 

[djs]

(BTW, after company gets a death certif, how long does it take them to pay? Should be a week, but I bet they drag it out for the float.)

Al

I don't know if someone has lost a dime (I imagine the answer is yes, but hopefully not much more than an administrative fee).

The answer to the second part of the question is based on the application, it depends on how you fill out the delay clause statement. On my apps, the default delay is 15 days. I do spend time explaining this to clients to make sure they understand this, and the reason behind it.

In California, and I assume most other states, insurance companies are pretty heavily regulated about delaying death benefit claims. There is some leeway for when fraud is suspected, but I imagine they are limited on the number of times they can use that excuse as well. I don't remember the particulars, but I think it's something like if they don't pay out within 30 days, the company gets fined something like 5% per day. They pay

Dan

 

[arnguy]

I'm not certain but I believe in PA that insurers can delay death benifit payment up to 6 months; however, they must have a reasonable cause for the delay. This is done to allow insurers time for investigation regarding payment to a benificiary when the death has been deemed to be "under suspicious circumstances," i.e., murder, suicide, etc.

 

[Agent]

Winter, I have answered and addressed your questions/points directly. For example:

You said "All of the major competitive companies are A-rated companies. When was the last time an A-rated company failed to pay a death benefit, and if the policy comes with guaranteed rates then the rates are set. In addition, states require companies to adjust their reserves as needed, and then there are re-insurance requirements as well. Some of it is like General Motors poo pooing cheap foreign imports for years and trading off of their solid name. It works a little but not as well as it used to."

In the next post you state: “I go back to the analogy with General Motors. You can trade off the name and the rock solid image for a long, long time and convince everybody that everything else is just a cheap foreign import and that price alone is not everything and so on and so forth. That will buy you some time. Eventually though GM ends out playing catch up to the other companies on price and performance.”

Again, my response: “Your General Motors analogy flaws in comparison in many areas but most noticeably it assumes that the underlining product is flawed and all the company relies on is their solid name. This may or may not have been true with General Motors but it is not with NYL.”

This answered your point the first time. You’re acting like no one is addressing your concerns when in actuality there being addressed rather directly. The NYL product is NOT flawed nor is NOT competitive, therefore your analogy with General Motors is false.

Again you said: “I was wondering if there is anything noteworthy or competitive about New York Life products- that's all. The answer I keep getting is that New York agents do well and if I really want to know anything about the products, I can get appointed with them and get their literature and find out. Not a strong argument fo New York Life products.”

Suggesting you get the info and judge the merits of their products from the horses mouth for yourself, does not speak negatively of NYL products and to say so is an attempt to illustrate a connection that in reality does not exist.

NYL agents do “do well” and so does, I’m sure, many Mass agents, Guardian agents etc.., but this is not the only answer you “keep getting” I said, and once again will say, that NYL products are competitive at the permanent level, which is where most of their sales happen.

As for companies and their agents/reps that may be doing well financially of a particular investment/insurance purchase but perhaps their client is not….I agree, that happens, however that reality exist with all agents, captive/career or independent.

The success of the agent, and the comment from David C was a reflection of their training and marketing skill and the potential and observational success of the agent with NYL. It was not an argument for their product, line so why criticize it as such?

NYL is a great company with great core products, if an agent wants to be a cheap term convenience store and the clientele that brings in, then more power to them. NYL agents in particular and MDRT agents as a whole go a different route.

Nak4Life

 

[Winter_123]

Suggesting you get the info and judge the merits of their products from the horses mouth for yourself, does not speak negatively of NYL products and to say so is an attempt to illustrate a connection that in reality does not exist.
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Okay, well, generally those who are associated with a company now or in the past can articulate the competitive strengths and weaknesses of the company's product offerings. Apparently that is not the case here other than generic statements about New York Life agents not focusing on term. There is no information about why an independant broker would want to offer New York Life products- only circular references as to why it is good for New York Life career agents and that one does not want to focus just on term, duh. There is no content there.

Maybe NYL's whole life rates are good, maybe the cash accumulation is more competitive compared to Prudential, ING or Mutual of Omaha. Don't know. All we know from the replies is that New York Life is a solid company and does not just sell term. As noted, GM will continue to sell to those who just look at a brand name. They also do not have clear responses to those who ask any questions below the 100,000 foot level as to why you would want a Chevy versus a Toyota. It works for a while.

Winter