- 3,384
Health Net CA just released same as Blue Shield CA, $500 FYC $250 Renewals.
CMS Commission Change
- Thread starter BrianK
- Start date
No I'm not an FMO
Are you privy to the commission rates next year? I'm not even positive what they really are this year.At this point I get full (same as last year or more in some cases) commission for new to MA's this year and half for the next five years after. I get half for MA switches this year and the same for the next five years.
So, If you are making 50% less than you made last year are you only flipping folks from one MA to another? Are you not signing ANY new to MA clients?
How many years should you get full commission for switching folks back and forth between MA plans?
If this forces some of you to become full time insurance agents, sorry. If this forces some of you to move to a different line of work, glad. The feeding frenzy is over. Time to do what the rest of us have always done, diversify and work all year long.
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- 185
Updated 2009 Commission Rates for Aetna Individual Medicare Plans
Based on recently issued guidance by the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services (CMS), we have had to revise our 2009 commission rates for Aetna Individual Medicare Advantage Plans. The commission rates below apply to any enrollment already made during this open enrollment period, with an effective date of January 1, 2009, as well as any future enrollments in 2009. 2008-2009: DIRECT PRODUCER COMPENSATIONRegionHMO/PPOPFFSPDP
New BusinessRenewal*New BusinessRenewal*New BusinessRenewal*
Northeast (except CT, N. NJ)$400$200$350 $175$50 $25
Mid-Atlantic (except PA, S. NJ, DC)$400$200$350 $175$50 $25
Southeast $400 $200$400 $200$50 $25
North Central $400$200$400 $200$50 $25
Southwest $400 $200$250 $125$50 $25West (except CA)$400 $200$350 $175$50 $25
2008-2009: DIRECT PRODUCER COMPENSATION STATE VARIATIONS
StateHMO/PPOPFFSPDP
New BusinessRenewal*New BusinessRenewal*New BusinessRenewal*
Connecticut$450 $225$350 $175$50 $25
New Jersey$450$225$350 $175$50 $25
District of Columbia$450$225$350$175$50 $25
Pennsylvania$450 $225$350 $175$50 $25
California$500$250$350 $175$50 $25
*** Oh, and will an FMO please check my CMS Captive Agent Guidance Post and let me know how he carriers are guiding you. Thanks.
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Non-golfing Agent
Expert
- 76
No I'm not an FMO
At this point I get full (same as last year or more in some cases) commission for new to MA's this year and half for the next five years after. I get half for MA switches this year and the same for the next five years.
So, If you are making 50% less than you made last year are you only flipping folks from one MA to another? Are you not signing ANY new to MA clients?
How many years should you get full commission for switching folks back and forth between MA plans?
If this forces some of you to become full time insurance agents, sorry. If this forces some of you to move to a different line of work, glad. The feeding frenzy is over. Time to do what the rest of us have always done, diversify and work all year long.
I didn't see any post where he said MA is the only products he offers.
Give a little and they'll take everything. Annuities, Med Supp, MA's...UL probably next.
I see a positive in the new compensation structure, for some of the companies. I was of course generalizing, but we have known for a couple years that MA's were on the chopping block.
This year I am getting at least $100 more for new to MA's and a little over $100 less for flipping to a different MA. All in all, it could have been much worse, and now we are being given in general a higher renewal rate. Yes, it expires, but only after another 5 years. I am going to make about the same amount this year as last for the same number of policies, plus I am now 'assured' of another five years of commission. Half empty/half full. I prefer to be positive and see it as half full.
As long as there is a need for sales, there will be compensation. Yes it will be subjective and based on the need for sales. Are we going to be cut back on some, if not all, product commissions in the future? Depends on supply and demand. We can't profess conservative fiscal viewpoints and not understand that we are just as subject to market economics as much as the GM and Ford workers. Y'all could start selling less and it would increase the value to the companies of the sales you do make, thus driving up commissions.
My point was that to survive an agent needs to have more than just one bullet in his gun.
They are already taking, cutting, conspiring and stealing commissions on the other products. Anyone here who trusts insurance companies to do the right thing by agents or customers unless it is to the insurance companies advantage may not have a grasp on actuarial science and corporate greed.
No personal criticism has been intended, except to corporate entities of course.
This year I am getting at least $100 more for new to MA's and a little over $100 less for flipping to a different MA. All in all, it could have been much worse, and now we are being given in general a higher renewal rate. Yes, it expires, but only after another 5 years. I am going to make about the same amount this year as last for the same number of policies, plus I am now 'assured' of another five years of commission. Half empty/half full. I prefer to be positive and see it as half full.
As long as there is a need for sales, there will be compensation. Yes it will be subjective and based on the need for sales. Are we going to be cut back on some, if not all, product commissions in the future? Depends on supply and demand. We can't profess conservative fiscal viewpoints and not understand that we are just as subject to market economics as much as the GM and Ford workers. Y'all could start selling less and it would increase the value to the companies of the sales you do make, thus driving up commissions.
My point was that to survive an agent needs to have more than just one bullet in his gun.
They are already taking, cutting, conspiring and stealing commissions on the other products. Anyone here who trusts insurance companies to do the right thing by agents or customers unless it is to the insurance companies advantage may not have a grasp on actuarial science and corporate greed.
No personal criticism has been intended, except to corporate entities of course.
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- 15,319
I see nothing positive anytime the government intrudes into my personal property, which includes the income I am paid to do my job. Just another instance of big brother sticking their nose in where it is not wanted.
All, and I mean all problems with MA plans, churning, and dishonest agents have been caused by CMS and the jackasses in Congress. They are the ones that decided lock-in was a good idea. They decided to fund these plans at 115% or more of Medicare reimbursement. They are the onese who set things up to screw both the senior and the agent.
The amount of commission is not the issue. It's the government placing caps and minimums that is wrong.
That being said, I'm still writing business. The commissions are higher than they were in 2006. It's the principle that I'm attacking here and it is sure to get worse for us with Obama.
Screw CMS. Screw the lawyers. Screw Congress. Let's get some people in office that have read the Constitution.
Rick
All, and I mean all problems with MA plans, churning, and dishonest agents have been caused by CMS and the jackasses in Congress. They are the ones that decided lock-in was a good idea. They decided to fund these plans at 115% or more of Medicare reimbursement. They are the onese who set things up to screw both the senior and the agent.
The amount of commission is not the issue. It's the government placing caps and minimums that is wrong.
That being said, I'm still writing business. The commissions are higher than they were in 2006. It's the principle that I'm attacking here and it is sure to get worse for us with Obama.
Screw CMS. Screw the lawyers. Screw Congress. Let's get some people in office that have read the Constitution.
Rick
That is the biggest problem with these recent regulations. Free Market be damned, the government is setting the commission rates.
We are obviously heading for federalized health insurance, and it is a moot point, because the constitution is being reinterpreted regularly by the Executive, Legislative and Judicial branches of the government, and regulation is going to be the focus for at least the next four years. I plan to seek opportunities where I can find them and roll with the punches. What else can we do? It is a stacked deck.
We are obviously heading for federalized health insurance, and it is a moot point, because the constitution is being reinterpreted regularly by the Executive, Legislative and Judicial branches of the government, and regulation is going to be the focus for at least the next four years. I plan to seek opportunities where I can find them and roll with the punches. What else can we do? It is a stacked deck.
Man we have short memories. I remember when MA plans first came out. Here in Georgia, Humana was the only player the first year. We got paid $175 for a Medicare Advantage enrollment and the renewals were, I believe, $6 per month. And we were happy to get it because it allowed us to start selling to a clientele we otherwise couldn't reach due to the fact that many of them couldn't afford a Medicare Supplement. I have viewed this as found money.
As patch pointed out, many are actually getting a higher commission this year for new to MA enrollments and the renewals are higher as well (compared to last year). I admit, I was a little bummed out when I saw they were cutting commissions for those that are switching MA plans. Mainly because it doesn't lessen my work load to switch someone. If the carriers wouldn't make changes to the plans, there would be no need to switch. So I too understand the frustration of getting paid less for the same work. Hopefully the fact that most of the carriers are now paying very similar commissions, the products won't change much from year to year moving forward and we can leave clients right where they are. With the exception of when the PFFS plans go away. Then we will have another round of changes for those on PFFS plans.
Patch is also correct in that if MA plans is your only or main line of business, you need to diversify. If you only have this one arrow in your quiver, you are going to be out of business soon. Unfortunately, many got into this business just to sell MA plans for the quick buck and now they are struggling. It's time to learn to sell other products and services or get out of the business. Quite frankly, after going to a couple of the certification meetings this year, I think thinning the herd would be a good thing. There were people in those meetings that I really don't see how they could have passed the certification exam, let alone the insurance licensing test.
After almost 20 years in the business, if I've seen nothing else, I've seen change. This business changes often and you have to be able to roll with it.
As patch pointed out, many are actually getting a higher commission this year for new to MA enrollments and the renewals are higher as well (compared to last year). I admit, I was a little bummed out when I saw they were cutting commissions for those that are switching MA plans. Mainly because it doesn't lessen my work load to switch someone. If the carriers wouldn't make changes to the plans, there would be no need to switch. So I too understand the frustration of getting paid less for the same work. Hopefully the fact that most of the carriers are now paying very similar commissions, the products won't change much from year to year moving forward and we can leave clients right where they are. With the exception of when the PFFS plans go away. Then we will have another round of changes for those on PFFS plans.
Patch is also correct in that if MA plans is your only or main line of business, you need to diversify. If you only have this one arrow in your quiver, you are going to be out of business soon. Unfortunately, many got into this business just to sell MA plans for the quick buck and now they are struggling. It's time to learn to sell other products and services or get out of the business. Quite frankly, after going to a couple of the certification meetings this year, I think thinning the herd would be a good thing. There were people in those meetings that I really don't see how they could have passed the certification exam, let alone the insurance licensing test.
After almost 20 years in the business, if I've seen nothing else, I've seen change. This business changes often and you have to be able to roll with it.
- 1,908
Obviously, those who are complaining about the commission structure, no matter what it is, don't concentrate in the health insurance market.
On major medical plans, for individuals and families, the commission is at best 15%. And that includes:
And for that you want to make MORE?
Referrals in the senior market are stronger, stay on the books longer, and will sign up with whatever you recommend.
I believe getting paid "as earned", and levelizing commissions, is the way to weed out the "posers" in the senior market.
(getting back on my throne)
Oh, and just to let you know, I also sell LTC, Life, Health, LTC and Annuities, so I don't have to cover my nut every December.
On major medical plans, for individuals and families, the commission is at best 15%. And that includes:
- going through underwriting
- making sure docs are in-network
- being worried that, three months later, a better plan will arise
- rate ups for pre-ex
- premium payments not being paid
And for that you want to make MORE?
Referrals in the senior market are stronger, stay on the books longer, and will sign up with whatever you recommend.
I believe getting paid "as earned", and levelizing commissions, is the way to weed out the "posers" in the senior market.
(getting back on my throne)
Oh, and just to let you know, I also sell LTC, Life, Health, LTC and Annuities, so I don't have to cover my nut every December.
- 19,647
Just a simple move of doing away with lock-in would solve most of these problems.
Without lock-in, clients would not be stuck in bad plans even if they were sold a bill of goods. The market would weed out the pretenders and the cream would rise to top and the pretenders would fall away.
Bob is correct in that the senior market is great about referrals. It works both ways. They tell each other about good plans and problem plans.
Even if lock-in is to continue, it should be changed. It is ridiculous to have AEP during this time. Not only because of the holidays, but, also because of the weather. I had to postpone two appointments yesterday because of ice covered roads. I have to now try and find a way to get to those people before Dec. 31 and just hope that, if I can find time, the weather doesn't deaal us another setback.
Why not have AEP, if there has to be one, during June, July and August?
I agree with Rick that every problem in this market has been the result of some kind of silly ass CMS rule or regulation.
Without lock-in, clients would not be stuck in bad plans even if they were sold a bill of goods. The market would weed out the pretenders and the cream would rise to top and the pretenders would fall away.
Bob is correct in that the senior market is great about referrals. It works both ways. They tell each other about good plans and problem plans.
Even if lock-in is to continue, it should be changed. It is ridiculous to have AEP during this time. Not only because of the holidays, but, also because of the weather. I had to postpone two appointments yesterday because of ice covered roads. I have to now try and find a way to get to those people before Dec. 31 and just hope that, if I can find time, the weather doesn't deaal us another setback.
Why not have AEP, if there has to be one, during June, July and August?
I agree with Rick that every problem in this market has been the result of some kind of silly ass CMS rule or regulation.
