Columbian and Agents Without Morals

nfl72

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I had a situation come to head today that has been going on for about 45 days and am looking for some advice.

I first got into FE about 2 and a half years ago. I was always under the impression when I rewrote polices I had to have a good viable reason to do so. You know a benefit to the client. AFter what happened today I am starting to wonder.

I ran a lead in Grand Rapids on 9/15/11. I could not get him to agree to speak with me in person because he already had a Columbian policy for quite a few years. I knew the 76 year old man was not all that sharp so I suggested he let me speak with his daughter, which he did. When I suggested I could possibly save them some money and get him a better policy, they agreed to meet with me.

He had a $6K policy and was paying $88 per month. I got him approved at Foresters on a 10K level plan at $101 a month. He also got $1750 from his cash value. He was a happy camper. I also wrote his daughter and son.

About 3 weeks after we cancelled the old policy the other agent called me and made all kinds of threats etc. He also stated to the clients that Foresters was a horrible company who would never pay when he passed. He also said there was no way the Foresters policy didnt have a 2 year waiting period. Over the next two weeks I had several calls from the two sisters who stated the agent would not leave them alone. He keept showing up and could not convince them to do anything. He writes through Mutual of Detroit. Most agents there pick up premiums from clients each month as he sometimes did. I have replaced probably 15 to 20 Mutal of Detroit policies in GRand Rapids over the past 2 years. I belive they had a merger with Columbian as they now answer the phone Columbian Insurance group. They all seem to be a bunch of snakes and their policies are some of the most expensive I have ever seen.

I got an email from Foresters today about the client requesting to cancel his policy in writing as it was being replaced. When I called the client he knew nothing about that and I even spoke with his daughters and they knew nothing about it either. According to the daughter the other agent showed up at her fathers house about a week ago when he was home alone, and actualy stold the policy from him. When she found out she called him and he said he would drop it off which he never did. It appears he forged a cancellation and rewrote a columbian policy on the guy. Knowing what I think I know about Columbian it has to be way more expensive than a Plan Right Level?

I am meeting with the client on Tuesday to reinstate the Foresters policy. I am not so naive to not consider the guy just didnt want to tell me he cancelled his policy but he swears up and down as do his daughters that he will not do anything financial without them being involved. And they keeep calling me asking me what they can do?

Any suggestions on how to handle this would be appreciated.
 
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Isn't Foresters run by the guy who ran Union Bankers?
Just saying
I won't ever sell Foresters, I'll stick to Columbian, Motorists, Standard, Oxford, and a few others.
And it looks like you are reflecting a bad agent " from your perspective" with a good company.
 
If that other agent really forged a signature. Have the client complain to the DOI in your state and it will be game over for him.
 
I agree that Columbian is not a bad company. You are just dealing with a bad agent.

All companies have loose screws like that.

I ran across a Settlers agent recently replaced his own LH policy on a guy and didn't fill out the replacement form. The man died a few months later and if the agent just would have done his job correctly it would have been non contestable. He screwed the family over.

And I think Settlers is one of the most honest companies in final expense. They all have a few dirt balls.
 
I agree that Columbian is not a bad company. You are just dealing with a bad agent.

All companies have loose screws like that.

I ran across a Settlers agent recently replaced his own LH policy on a guy and didn't fill out the replacement form. The man died a few months later and if the agent just would have done his job correctly it would have been non contestable. He screwed the family over.

And I think Settlers is one of the most honest companies in final expense. They all have a few dirt balls.
How would a replacement notification have guarenteed that the new policy have paid off in the first 2 years?
 
I have ran across 5 or 6 agents from Mutual of Detroit and they were all a bunch of liars and con men. I have been told by numerous people who seem to be in the know that they have been under investigation for several years, which I tend to believe based on what I have ran in to. If that wee the case and Columbian is so straight, why would they take on agents like that?

I ran into a lady about 8 months ago who claimed she had never missed a payment. She bought the policy when her child was born and her child is now 14. According to her policy it should have had a cash value of almost $4,500. When we called it in they quoted $672.00. The agent was picking up case payments every month. The lady was deeply religious and didnt drink, smoke or even swear. I believed her when she said she never missed a payment.

For about 6 months I worked with a company called First Financial and they had Columbian but lead me to beleive they were best for a GI policy and that their rates were very high. Are you guys suggesting their rates are competitive with Foresters? Most of the Columbian policies I have ran across were graded or modified, when they didn't need to be.
 
You should call the MI DOI, and ask for an investigation. Be very clear and precise just as you have been in this posting, as to what happened, and why the agent in question should be investigated. Also, let Foresters know that this is a allegedly forged document. Maybe they don't care, or maybe they will want to get to the bottom of this. After all, the agent already broke the law by telling the insured that Foresters would never pay his claim, etc. Furthermore, make sure this man and his daughters know what you're doing, as the DOI will likely follow up with them to determine the validity of the complaint. (Which we know is very valid).

It is illegal and highly unethical for this punk to continue harassing these folks, when he is no longer their agent. Furthermore, it is also illegal for him to have taken this man's policy. It is harassment.....period. Furthermore, if he forged this guys signature on a Columbian application, that (I believe) constitutes fraud, which is a felony and subject to incarceration is he is found guilty of such.

If he isn't brought before the powers that be, and get his license revoked, then I will be more than shocked (assuming what you say here is true, which I am sure it is).

Another thought.....have you called the office that this guy works out of? I think by letting the boss man know what's going on, it would be an extra step in ensuring that if this guy is still employed by the time the state gets ahold of him, they can take his boss down as well, for knowing about an alleged incident of fraud, without doing anything about it. (Can you say "Penn State"?). Sometimes you just have to make examples out of people. These guys already have you on their sh!&list most likely.

No offense, but don't be a wanker, dude. Call the DOI, as it's scum like that who give all of us honest and decent agents out there a bad name. We must clean up the scum from within sometimes.


Good luck to you on that.
 
How would a replacement notification have guarenteed that the new policy have paid off in the first 2 years?


In the case that newby is talking about it was in Ky. In Ky a new contestability period is not allowed in replacement situations.

Because of that law some companies will not do replacements in the state. Knowing that the company he was using to replace did not do replacements in Ky the agent didn't write it up as a replacement. The guy died a few months later and the new comapny was going to contest the claim.

They can't because of the law. Even though they don't do replacements here he was acting as their agent, so they are on the hook. The agent did try to maintain that he did not know there was another policy in place, but he was also the agent on that policy.

Had he just used a company that did allow replacements here he would have been in the clear as would the family.

There is much more to the story than can be shared here. I've run into some cases where that guy did the same thing with others and did not do a replacement. He did not get exposed on those because they didn't die.

I know he has been terminated from those two companies. I don't know how much further this is going to go or come back on him. He does have E&O because it's the law here, {well, that or a bond}. This is not an E&O case, however. I suppose it could be if he actually didn't know there was a policy in place.
 
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