Final Expense Leads...Whats Your Opinion?

[Josh]

Take it how you will my friend. Why are you here?

Mostly to get people to type "Josh" into their browsers and hit enter.

 

[FedUpWithIMOs]

By reset, they mean close your account and start another with a different name. Preferably one that does not point to a recruitment site since you're not here for that.
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...what type of lead do you like best and why?

To answer your question though, I like DM leads. The originals, not scanned copies. I've had a couple bad experiences with TLs. There seems to be a lot higher occurrence of non-reputable companies when it comes to telemarketing. Then, as mentioned, you gotta get to them immediately. Especially for FE.
Whichever lead type initially used, you gotta get good at getting quality referrals. QUALITY, not just quantity. With my referrals; if it's a situation where I'm being told by my client this person has been looking for/really needs coverage, I'll directly ask them about it. For most of them, I take a soft approach, and don't contact them to make a sell. I just introduce myself, offer a service, give them my information, etc. A lot of the selling is in making them buy into you. A lot of agents are scared of referrals. It's all in how you set it up with the person who did the referring.

 

[iFinalExpense.com]

They're pretty close to mailers.. tried them both- One thing about TL's are that there are a few pre-qualified questions asked.. confined to a wheelchair, currently in a nursing home, do you have a checking acct?.. that mailers dont.. TL's are also very quick to obtain- No waiting around for 6 weeks to start getting them in like mailers- Thing with TL's- you have to get on them ASAP or most will forget they even talked to anybody and there's no BRM you can use to jar one's memory..

I think the quality is a little better on BRM,but not by much.. TL's are also cheaper in costs, and the best thing is.. when you buy 20.. you get 20..Whereas mailers.. you roll the dice.. you might get 4 back on a 1000 mailer

I most certainly will door knock a TL lead.. If I'm unable to contact a lead..., but in general.. they mostly will pickup.. if you cant get a hold of a lead.. look at the time the call was taken... what day and call around the same time and day..

I'm finding anywhere between 2 to maybe 3 leads closing per 10 on TL's.. it's not great.. but the ROI is pretty high.. You'll need 25 a week to write good business

Regarding the TL's. How were the leads generated? English speaking TM or Outsourced?
I have used both and havent had any luck with the Off Shore Outsourced TL. I am looking into Voicemail leads. Have you had experience with that? These sound great, But I have yet to try them. What I do like, Is you can have leads in 24-48 hours.

 

[Josh]

I am looking into Voicemail leads. Have you had experience with that? These sound great, But I have yet to try them. What I do like, Is you can have leads in 24-48 hours.

They're completely illegal.

 

[TPAAgent]

Regarding the TL's. How were the leads generated? English speaking TM or Outsourced?
I have used both and havent had any luck with the Off Shore Outsourced TL. I am looking into Voicemail leads. Have you had experience with that? These sound great, But I have yet to try them. What I do like, Is you can have leads in 24-48 hours.

Tread lightly on the voice mail leads.. it's a $10,000 fine.. and they are handing them out....

It's a numbers game... I get 20 TL's a week and work 4 days a week.. tues, wed , thurs and yes.. Saturday.. Sat is a my best day..I start at 10am and work just 4 hours.. and call it quits at 2pm.. during the week.. I'll get whatever TL's I have, pull up my list, find clients on the same street or over a couple and make it a point to knock on 15-25 doors a day.. I usually bring 35 in case I need extra.. but I dont return home till I've knocked on at least 20 doors a day..Monday I dont do sh*t.. My wifes at work, sons at school and I hang around on the couch all day watching the history channel.. the world can kiss my ass on mondays.. friday is usually my service day.. always run into that one knucklehead client that cant seem to have that $28 in the bank on draft day or some goofy rep for a carrier that seems to think I need a replacement form on a pending acct for a client with no existing life insurance....

 

[iFinalExpense.com]

Tread lightly on the voice mail leads.. it's a $10,000 fine.. and they are handing them out....

It's a numbers game... I get 20 TL's a week and work 4 days a week.. tues, wed , thurs and yes.. Saturday.. Sat is a my best day..I start at 10am and work just 4 hours.. and call it quits at 2pm.. during the week.. I'll get whatever TL's I have, pull up my list, find clients on the same street or over a couple and make it a point to knock on 15-25 doors a day.. I usually bring 35 in case I need extra.. but I dont return home till I've knocked on at least 20 doors a day..Monday I dont do sh*t.. My wifes at work, sons at school and I hang around on the couch all day watching the history channel.. the world can kiss my ass on mondays.. friday is usually my service day.. always run into that one knucklehead client that cant seem to have that $28 in the bank on draft day or some goofy rep for a carrier that seems to think I need a replacement form on a pending acct for a client with no existing life insurance....

Not a bad week.
I like your style my friend.

On the TL leads, are they outsourced or English speaking TMs that generate these leads? Do you work TL's exclusively? When your doing door knocks, are they on the calling list?
Thanks for the feed back. this is the info I was hoping for.
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Tread lightly on the voice mail leads.. it's a $10,000 fine.. and they are handing them out....

It's a numbers game... I get 20 TL's a week and work 4 days a week.. tues, wed , thurs and yes.. Saturday.. Sat is a my best day..I start at 10am and work just 4 hours.. and call it quits at 2pm.. during the week.. I'll get whatever TL's I have, pull up my list, find clients on the same street or over a couple and make it a point to knock on 15-25 doors a day.. I usually bring 35 in case I need extra.. but I dont return home till I've knocked on at least 20 doors a day..Monday I dont do sh*t.. My wifes at work, sons at school and I hang around on the couch all day watching the history channel.. the world can kiss my ass on mondays.. friday is usually my service day.. always run into that one knucklehead client that cant seem to have that $28 in the bank on draft day or some goofy rep for a carrier that seems to think I need a replacement form on a pending acct for a client with no existing life insurance....

Oh, and for the VM leads.
Doesnt it just matter on the states your calling?

 

[Josh]

Oh, and for the VM leads.
Doesnt it just matter on the states your calling?

If it's b2c, it's illegal in every state.

 

[iFinalExpense.com]

If it's b2c, it's illegal in every state.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention. we just had a call with a lead vendor today regarding this. its new to me so I didnt think to ask the question. But I will be calling him tomorrow to see what he says. I will post the response here for additional feedback.
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If it's b2c, it's illegal in every state.

I was looking at the vendore website and thought maybe I should explain more how there lead works. make sure we are all comparing apples to apples.
The client doesnt get a voice mail. they answer the phone, listen to a message press one to leave a voice mail for the agent to call them back when they will be available. are we talking about the same thing here?

 

[Josh]

Yes, that is illegal. It's called voice broadcasting. Part of the law reads that insurance companies are exempt, but that does not apply if someone is trying to make a sale. Doctors share the same exemption, but it only applies to reminder calls, etc. If it's to try to sell something they have to follow the same rules as everyone else.

The short version is that if you google "FTC voice braodcasting ban sept 1, 2009" you'll see some great information about it. I wrote out a fairly lengthy post about the ins and outs of it on another thread, but anyone that says you can voice broadcast to consumers is trying to sell you something. If insurance companies were exempt from this rule and if the same exemption were to apply to insurance agents, then insurance agents wouldn't have to comply with the DNC laws, but clearly we do.
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Here is a novellette I wrote on the subject a short while ago. My apologies if it's phrased a little funny in parts because it was a response on a much longer thread, but a lot of good content here.

Admittedly the language is confusing, but in reviewing the situation as a whole, it becomes clear what that exemption really applies to. Let's start with something basic:

The FTC has jurisdiction over the DNC registry and that law does prevent individuals from receiving telemarketing calls from insurance agents to sell insurance products. We already know that. The same legal theory you believe applies to the ban on the voice broadcasting would also be able to invalidate that, but it hasn't. That in and of itself should clear up the misunderstanding, but there is plenty more.

Let's evaluate the exemption for non-profits vs non-profits that hire other firms to do their marketing. Non-profits can do their own marketing and can actually have other companies do it as well, provided the other companies are doing it for free as well. If the telemarketer making calls on behalf of a non-profit receives compensation for making said calls then they are profiting from it and now it is a for-profit business to consumer call which is exactly what is expressly prohibited. That is the reason why it can't get contracted out. Seems like a small thing, but that's where the line is. If I have a non-profit and hire a telemarketer to come work for me I can pay them as an employee, I just can't pay them as a business if I want to call on numbers listed in the DNC.

Let's also go back to the portion of the law that specifically states that insurance companies are exempt. If we were talking about an agency situation where the agent was captive to a specific carrier it would be worth spending some time getting into the details of that, but the reality is we're for the purposes of this thread now talking about independent agents. Independent agents are 1099, non-employee contractors. They by definition are not employees of the company and are not part of the insurance company. Again, if we were talking about a w2 organization then that may be a different story, but a w2 agent would have their companies compliance agent/attorney able to guide them with the companies position on this.

Now let's talking about the HIPAA exemption. If you read through the law, it doesn't give carte blanche approval for all "HIPAA related calls".
Healthcare Message Exemption
This exemption is limited to calls permitted under the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act of 1996 ("HIPAA"), pursuant to regulations issued by the Department of Health and Human Services. The only healthcare calls that are exempt are those "made by, or on behalf of, a covered entity or its business associate, as those terms are defined in the HIPAA Privacy Rule, 45 CFR 160.103."

The HIPAA Privacy Rule permits only three types of calls, whether "live" or prerecorded, by a healthcare provider or its business associates without a patient's prior authorization – namely: (1) calls to describe a health-related product or service that is provided by, or included in a plan of benefits of, the covered entity making the communication; (2) calls for treatment of the individual; and (3) calls for case management or care coordination for the individual, or to direct or recommend alternative treatments, therapies, health care providers, or settings of care to the individual. Only these three categories of prerecorded healthcare message calls are exempt from the 2008 TSR amendments prohibiting telemarketing calls that deliver a prerecorded message. Some examples of exempt healthcare-related HIPAA calls are:

• Prerecorded message calls made by or on behalf of a pharmacy to provide prescription refill reminders;
• Prerecorded message calls made by or on behalf of a medical provider to provide medical appointment or other reminders (e.g., availability of flu shots or mammograms);
• Prerecorded message calls made by or on behalf of a durable medical equipment supplier to document that a patient has used his or her current supply (e.g., of insulin needles or respiratory supplies) before sending additional supplies; and
• Prerecorded message calls by or on behalf of a case manager to check on a patient's condition.

Prerecorded messages involving products or services not prescribed by a doctor or other healthcare provider as part of a plan of treatment, and therefore not within the healthcare exemption would include, for example:

• Prerecorded message calls made by or on behalf of a provider of vitamins, minerals, or alternative medical therapies;
• Prerecorded message calls made by or on behalf of a provider of gym or health club memberships; or
• Prerecorded message calls made by or on behalf of a provider of weight loss products or programs.

In one sentence it makes it perfectly clear: "Prerecorded messages involving products or services not prescribed by a doctor or other healthcare provider as part of a plan of treatment, and therefore not within the healthcare exemption "


To circle back to a point above, the TSR isn't just a ban on voice broadcasting, it's the totality of the laws the FTC has referred to as the "Telemarketing Sales Rule". This is most notably in reference to the DNC registry and restrictions on when folks can and cannot be telemarketed, but the most recent ban on voice broadcasting is simply an addition to the existing rule or set of rules.

I think it's neat that you looked at this the way that you did and I sincerely think it's an interesting little section of the TSR. Unfortunately it's perfectly clear that the exemptions noted in the law specifically apply to business, companies, and providers using voice broadcasting tools to more or less conduct business with existing clients and/or individuals they have an existing relationship with. It is remarkably clear that even within the exemptions, as soon as a company crosses from providing their service to trying to sell something (a doctor calling to remind a patient about an appointment vs trying to sell them vitamins), it crosses the line and becomes a sales call that is regulated by the FTC, regardless of the industry.

 

[Shalom]

Mostly to get people to type "Josh" into their browsers and hit enter.

I just LoL'd out loud