Oxford Declined Question

[Todd King]

Apparently you missed the part where I stated time will tell. As stated earlier, final expense is priced at a loss for years, then the numbers begin to work out. How many FE companies have dropped out? Foremost, Shenandoah, Forethought....
How many companies have made rate increases, commission changes and underwriting/app changes?
Think they were all profiting like mad and that is why they left or made changes?

Oxford may be right, may be wrong, time will tell as stated earlier. Just playing devils advocate to some questionable posts like Gordon:

Oxford has tighter UW, a very time consuming POS interview and they cut renewals in half.

Original Street was Yr 1- 105%, Yrs2-10 - 7%, Yrs 11+- 1%
New Street Yr 1- 120%, Yrs2-5 - 5%, Yrs 6-10 - 2%

15% increase in year 1, 29% increase 2-5, 72% increase 6-10
Depending on persistency, it takes until year 9 or 10 to start seeing lesser pay on the new scale than the old. Is this good or bad? Depends on the agent, just like to have facts out rather than false assumptions or half information.

I'm not getting your numbers here; they just don't add up correctly.

If you take the old contract at 105% 1st year, years 2-10 @7% (70%), that all adds up to 175% over 10 years.

120% 1st year, years 2-5 @5% (20%), and years 6-10 @2% (10%), that adds up to 150%.

So, over 10 years the agent is making 20% less, but they are making 15% more the 1st year...woohooo!

 

[donamese]

I'm not getting your numbers here; they just don't add up correctly.

If you take the old contract at 105% 1st year, years 2-10 @7% (70%), that all adds up to 175% over 10 years.

120% 1st year, years 2-5 @5% (20%), and years 6-10 @2% (10%), that adds up to 150%.

So, over 10 years the agent is making 20% less, but they are making 15% more the 1st year...woohooo!

I was taking in to account persistency. You are correct, assuming 100% of the block stays on for 10 years, but we all know this is not the norm. Lapses are fairly common in the 1st couple years of a final expense policy. If a policy stays on the books 6 years or less, you make more on the new schedule. Year 7 is where they break even and then renewals start to be the better option.

 

[PaperHanger]

Re the OP
I had a similar situation recently. .. very healthy 79 yo female, no Rx, takes vitamins, excercises, etc...decline on POS.

Then she remembers the patch she just got on the suggestion of her daughter. ..to help make her 'sharper'...huh?

She spelled it exacly right, so I typed it into Google on my phone. .. Alzheimer's, go figure...but to her credit, she did remember to call me the next day to recend the app, due to a 'family situation'...I assume the situation involved a daughter reminding her to not take out any life insurance.... :head smack

At least I was saved the angry call from a daughter or son I usually get when I unbeknowingstly take one of those apps, accusing me of taking advantage blah blah

Usually there is a red med in their past that shows up on MIB that the applicant forgot about,
but actually UHL did me a solid recently by probing more and finding a red med was only used for a post op, and then discontinued shortly afterwards...I think it was a blood thinner after knee surgury, or something like that. They gave her immediate on that one.

 

[ZenSamurai]

Re the OP
I had a similar situation recently. .. very healthy 79 yo female, no Rx, takes vitamins, excercises, etc...decline on POS.

Then she remembers the patch she just got on the suggestion of her daughter. ..to help make her 'sharper'...huh?

She spelled it exacly right, so I typed it into Google on my phone. .. Alzheimer's, go figure...but to her credit, she did remember to call me the next day to recend the app, due to a 'family situation'...I assume the situation involved a daughter reminding her to not take out any life insurance.... :head smack

At least I was saved the angry call from a daughter or son I usually get when I unbeknowingstly take one of those apps, accusing me of taking advantage blah blah

Usually there is a red med in their past that shows up on MIB that the applicant forgot about,
but actually UHL did me a solid recently by probing more and finding a red med was only used for a post op, and then discontinued shortly afterwards...I think it was a blood thinner after knee surgury, or something like that. They gave her immediate on that one.

I can't understand why they would consider Life Insurance agents to take advantage of people. When people pass away their children or anybody paying for the funeral will need that money.

 

[Gooner]

Just found out a new one yesterday. PI had skin cancer 4 years ago and the 1 time med came up(don't know what it was ) and gave us the auto decline/escalation. Called Amanda and she said it would've been issued...they'd write a ton more business if they would let there underwriters make reasonable decisions.

 

[ZenSamurai]

Just found out a new one yesterday. PI had skin cancer 4 years ago and the 1 time med came up(don't know what it was ) and gave us the auto decline/escalation. Called Amanda and she said it would've been issued...they'd write a ton more business if they would let there underwriters make reasonable decisions.

They are a very affordable company from what it seems but their underwriting has to get straightened out. I'm still the new guy but my case as well as your case and a few others I've read just seem out of place. The interviewer says "decline" and then ask if you would like to escalate it and there's a chance that it won't be declined.

Would it be possible to escalate a case as well as write them up to another in case they do get declined by Oxford?

 

[smokin goose]

They are a very affordable company from what it seems but their underwriting has to get straightened out. I'm still the new guy but my case as well as your case and a few others I've read just seem out of place. The interviewer says "decline" and then ask if you would like to escalate it and there's a chance that it won't be declined. Would it be possible to escalate a case as well as write them up to another in case they do get declined by Oxford?

It would be a lot easier to just place them with someone else. IMO.

 

[deadhead]

It would be a lot easier to just place them with someone else. IMO.

Standard Life and Casualty works for me

 

[ZenSamurai]

Standard Life and Casualty works for me

Are their rates as competitive as Oxford's?

 

[smokin goose]

Are their rates as competitive as Oxford's?

They are usually right below them. Do you have fexquotes?