United Independent Wholesale Insurance Network (UandIWin)

[Crabcake Johnny]

The person who called me from UandIWin after I registered stated that all Assurant agents received the exact same commission; 15%. After that it's based on performance and some convoluted bonus system.

Listen, anyone can start at 20% commish and it's 25% after $75,000. So I don't know just how the bonus program is structured but it better be designed so that producers at 15% end up with 25% in commish if they're doing $1,500 a week on production.

I was also told that I've have to give up my GA contract and go in as a producer. However, somehow I'd still get overrides off my sub-agents.

I'll give everyone this piece of advice:

Watch going into any organization that's offering a low base commission - like 15% for Assurant, and making up the rest of it in bonuses. They can change their bonus structure at will and you have nowhere to go. I'm not saying that UandIWin would do this, but they most certainly are holding all the cards.

For example, say they put me at 15% commish with Assurant and bonuses would make up another 10%. In theory I'm getting paid the same. However, if I have a dispute I cannot go to Assurant. I have to battle it out with this out of state company.

I told the guy on the phone that I'd need to retain my GA status with all my sub-agents directly under me. He was not interested in that which means they simply want all the control.

By the way, this is an Assurant MGA, so they can absolutely give out GA contracts at 25% and allow sub-agents directly under you. That they are not allowing this is a huge red flag for me.

Assurant GAs get special bonuses and trips - which you don't get even if you're compensated at a 25% rate if you're a writing agent.

 

[STIBROKER]

and most likely they own all your buss........

 

[Shep]

and most likely they own all your buss........

Hey STI, thanks, that's a good point! What a great forum, you guys really help with the "heads up" on things so us newbies don't get burned too badly!

So I checked and talked with 2 different folks in the company, and if you try this thing and write some biz, and decide it's not for you, you keep your book of business if you leave. That's what I was told. So, I suppose it's like most IMO's in that way. I understand the captive companies are the ones that keep your book of business. But I don't have anything in writing...

Thanks for the help, you guys are awesome! If you think of anything else, please let me know! I have been asking them quite a few questions myself.

Thanks again, and Merry Christmas!

 

[Shep]

I told the guy on the phone that I'd need to retain my GA status with all my sub-agents directly under me. He was not interested in that which means they simply want all the control.

Hi John,

Thanks for the great information in your WHOLE post (I only quoted part of it), it's food for thought. The company wants to recruit exeperienced producing agents, but in their DVD and brochure they talk about the "average agent".

The way I understand it, using you as an example, you can keep all your contracts just as they are, outside of UandIWin. That is an extreme example, in other words, you would be a "recruiter only" for UandIWin. That would be a bad idea for someone who can't produce and teach others to do the same. You would end up with an organization of recruiters and no producers and no money.

In your example you are an extreme producer, so what you could do is bring in other agents who are "average" but want the ability to build an organization. They can get appointed thru UandIWin for whatever mix of products they wish to represent (and keep some contracts outside of UandIWin if they want), and just do two things: produce and recruit (in that order). You would be able to teach them and help them produce and/or recruit, and, even though you have no appts thru UandIWin, you would still make the bonuses from your downline volume, from whatever is in UandIWin, to 10 levels deep, and unlimited width.

The advantage to you is that UandIWin would handle all of the administration, paperwork, payments, etc. However, I'm not sure this setup would offer your agents any more than you already give them, esp. if they don't build an organization. Being new, I'm not familiar with how a "typical" agency system works with overrides, etc. However, I'm very familiar with MLM and network marketing, so I can "see" how it would work in the UandIWin model.

On that (MLM) point, the reason I never did anything with those outfits, is because as I studied what my friends and family did, I found out these downsides:

- they usually have overpriced proprietary products, the equivalent of which you can by at Walmart much cheaper and more conveniently. Not so w/ UandIWin, they carry the full product of the Insurace companies with no tricks in pricing to the "end consumer". The emphasis is (or should be, it will be in my organization) on producing steadily.

- With these other outfits you are usually selling soap or vitamins, or whatnot, and you don't make very much in the beginning. You are actually taught to recruit first, then switch you buying habits and "buy from yourself" and rely on your bonuses from your organization (who also start slow). So, between this and the gas, books, tapes, functions, etc. that you are pressured to do (else you are a "loser" and must not want to build the business) you are paying out way more than you are taking in. 99% of folks in those outfits LOSE MONEY and sometimes lots of it, right from the get go. This is not normally reported, for obvious reasons, but you can determine it from their compensation literature, where they are required to post average dist. earning, retention, etc. which usually reflects VERY POOR performance across the board.

What I like about UandIWin in this respect is that you can emphasize production (it doesn't have to be alot, just steady) before recruiting. Any agent worth his salt should be able to sell a health policy a week, or a life policy a month, at a minimum. The plan is based on that. And should do that every month (or much more) and set the example and teach the same. You can do a whole lot more of course, but to make the plan work, the minimums are okay for the "average agent" to duplicate that effort in building an organization, and "leverage" himself (as they say) into a great income. In this manner, it is believable and do-able by the "average agent". They can of course grow from there in their personal production, but there are no large quotas to scare anyone away. It is based on 1. producing yourself 2. reproducing yourself (duplication).

So, by emphasizing the importance of personal production, an agent funds his business and can pay his or her bills right out of the gate rather than steadily going further in the hole like in the other outfits where only the top 1% actually turn a profit, and not as much as they would have you believe. Obviously to be a recruiter only, you'd have to fund your business some other way in the beginning, but for someone like you, that would be no problem.

- Also, these other outfits (esp. the BIG one) have borderline illegal sideline businesses where they make MOST of their money at the top. It is the Distributor Marketing Organizations where they sell you books, tapes, functions, etc. that put you in the hole and keep you there. These activities are NOT sanctioned by the parent company, they just look the other way. And they are NOT products produced by the parent company, they are produced by the Dist Marketing Orgs. These outside-of-the-parent-company shady setups operate in little-known ways that have been described as akin to the Mafia in all respects. But that's a whole 'nother story, you can research it on the Internet if you want, and I can confirm it first hand. I don't see any of that with UandIWin, since the products are the same insurance company's products, and the emphasis is on selling THOSE, not sideline literature and meetings and seminars and such.

Again, for someone in John's position, as he said, UandIWin may not be able to offer him any more than he already has, but it may be a good fit for a another seasoned agent like John, but who does not already have sub-agents.

Thanks John for the info, I always want to do the right thing by the end customer, agents who I may recruit, and of course, myself. I value your knowledge and input. Thanks again and keep it coming if you think of other things to consider!


Shep

 

[somarco]

You do not have to give up your current contract.

You do not have to sign on with any carrier if you dont want to.

You still get bonuses on all carriers, whether you are appointed with them or not. (Still not sure how they do this).

Obviously, folks in your downline have to sign up with carriers and have to produce.

I have not switched any contracts. Dont intend to.

You own your business.

Your commissions are paid by the carrier. The override is paid to uandiwin. Bonuses are paid out of the override.

 

[Guest]

UandI is a MLM scheme and MLM is damn close to a pyramid scam. And this is not the first insurance MLM scheme/scam to come along... do some research on A.L. Williams which later went to Primerica.

I'm almost 60 and I've been self-employed for the past 30. In all my years I've never met one person who started in an MLM operation, remined in it for more than 24 months, and who ever made any (real) money from it.

I see it as all hype and a sucker's bet. The only ones who have a chance of making any money are those who get in at the beginning as they are at the 'top' of the pyramid (called a downline these days.)

Mark my words. UandI will have a brief "explosion" (they always use this term) of interest and it will fade. Why? Because once people become even average producers they will want their own book of biz, and not share their commissions with an upline.

It seems to me that you are an intelligent guy and that you are just wasting your time and energy with this get-rich scheme (scam). I think you are better advised to build your own independent biz or hook up with a mentor/coach and do it. Or become captive for a year or so and get some training. IF UandI is such a great thing, it will be around two years from now and think how much better you will be if you join it then?

I don't think you (or anyone except the founders) will do well with UandI and I don't even think they will be in business in 24 months.

Insurance MLM has been tried and tried and tried before and has not worked. But there are new suckers born every minute and if you ask me, you are acting like one of them.

If it were so easy and such a 'sure thing' wouldn't the experienced guys (of which I'm not one) on this board be flocking to it?

Look around. They're not.

Al

 

[somarco]

Personally, Al, I have no idea how much effort I will put into this. I look at this more of a novel idea than anything.

I first looked at it over a year ago and passed, so now I am looking at it again. The agency is about 3 years old, so it is not the fresh kid on the street.

If I get involved, and I have not decided yet, I will not switch any contracts since I am already topped out in all but one carrier.

The most money I made in this business came in years where I was leveraged . . . earning a significant portion of my income in overrides. I no longer depend on overrides to pay my bills, but do fully understand how to leverage my efforts by recruiting & training others to do what I do.

And FWIW, I am not a rookie in this business. I have more experience in the insurance industry than Sti & John Pet & James combined.

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

True - and experience talks so definitely listen to the most experienced people. I myself had an open mind while talking to one of the UandIWin guys. I've also already stated twice that it's a good place to go for an agent - especially an agent who wants to belong to a team and see their name in flashing lights when they do good production.

They personally cannot better my situation since I'm due to come up a commission notch with Assurant soon anyway. I also have agents and the overrides are indeed nice.

UandIWin is not a scam or a MLM. They simply focus on recruiting, however your Assurant RSD or MGA also recruting machines. At the RSD and MGA levels you have very high production goals you need to hit or you either lose your status or get canned.

The entire insurance industry is "MLMish." Everytime I write a deal my RSD gets a cut - then I hire people and I get a cut. I can also offer bonuses and even a small override if my agents bring in other agents.

 

[James]

The entire insurance industry is "MLMish." Everytime I write a deal my RSD gets a cut - then I hire people and I get a cut. I can also offer bonuses and even a small override if my agents bring in other agents.

If anything took me by suprise it is that the above is so true!

 

[somarco]

Basically, almost every business is MLM where someone earns off the efforts of others. Every time a Buick sales person sells a car, everyone in the dealer, all the way up to the CEO of GM, gets a cut.

Same thing with McDonalds, Wal-Mart and everything else.

The problem with traditional MLM companies, other than the number of shady characters who have been involved in the past (and present), is most of the products are overpriced versions of things you can get in any store. Nothing magic.

The products offered by UandIwin are the same products we sell every day. The opportunity is there to earn some extra bucks if you want to go for it.

I have not committed either way but I do find it intriguing. If I get involved you guys can ask in 6 months if it was worth it and I will tell you.