Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification calls

[beatuplunchbox]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

Thanks for all the input.

I was worried that I was missing out on something during my sales presentations. I did reall well with MA November-Mid Febuary but since it has been a real nightmare with all those enrollments being cancelled.

I was just trying to re-examine what went wrong.
It makes me feel better knowing I am not the only one having this problem.

Just talked to a former manager of mine who is selling coventry...
He is getting hammered with chargebacks-same problem: verification call.

 

[Bob_The_Insurance_Guy]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

Let me play Devil's Advocate here, ladies and gentlemen.

For the past 20 years, the senior community has been ripped off, decieved, and robbed by the insurance industry, so much so that HCFA (CMS) has had to step in to babysit us.

This is why buying leads, hiring a telemarketer, etc., will only lead to situations like this. I think it is great that the companies are asking these questions. As someone who does not do the volume you folks do in the MA and MedSupp market, but keeps a 98% persistency rate, I am glad they have this safety net for my clients. In fact, I TELL THEM THAT THEY WILL BE RECEIVING A CALL, JUST TO MAKE SURE I HAVE NOT INADVERTANTLY OMITTED SOMETHING IMPORTANT. I also tell my Medicare clients and prospects that the person on the other end of the phone is not an insurance agent, and doesn't care whether or not I make a sale. Their only concern is that the plan they have is what you know you're getting into, and that you will not change your mind anytime soon.

Health, Life, DI, LTC all have free look periods. With Medicare Advantage Plans, this is their version of it.

To answer your question, not only am I not losing any business because of the verification calls, I actually have two people on Advantra Freedom, and several on the Universal Any, Any, Any plans who, because of the verification calls, knew what they were getting into, and have renewed their plans, with me as the Agent of Record.

Prepare your clients and prospects as to what they are in for, including all aspects of the verification call, and you will lose only that business that wasn't yours to begin with.

When the insurance industry stops abusing the senior market, then these hoops we have to go through will disappear. Yes, these people are rude. Wouldn't you be, if you had to read the same thing, over and over, for $5.35/hr? You have to understand, every verification call they take, if it is charged back, they have to take a hit, just as we do.

My heart does not go out to any of you who have lost business, due to the verification call. You did not prepare your prospect/client well enough, or else, you did not develop a strong enough relationship with those people. The very first thing I tell all my prospects/clients, with any type of Health-based insurance product is that they will not receive 100% of what they want - whether it be doctors, medications, etc., and that the best we can do is find the closest to perfect.

People take weeks or months to find the house they want to live in, yet we expect them to understand a new health plan in an hour, and stay with it for a year?

Would you buy a car, without taking a test drive?
Would you eat food that has not been regulated by the FDA?
Would you buy an electrical appliance that was not tested by UL?

Like I said, I don't buy leads, or hire telemarketers to get my MA leads. All mine come from informational meetings I conduct, referrals, and renewals. I don't do the volume you do, but I also don't worry about charge backs. In fact, one of my MA clients received a postcard for a Universal Any, Any, Any plan presentation from someone else, and invited me to go with him. At the end of the presentation, he turned to me and said, "You did a much better job."

These insurance companies are also, primarily doing it for their own salvation. Just ask WellCare how important the raid by the Feds was last year. Whether something was found or not, it is the hint of inpropriatety that lingers.

We are paying the price for the acts of those in our profession, who came before us.

Sorry, but...

 

[GreenSky]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

Bob:

Don't you ever worry about falling off your pedestal?

Rick

 

[beatuplunchbox]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

It is a real shame for agents trying to do the right thing by their cusomers to be severly penalized by the actions of those who only want to make a quick buck.

 

[GreenSky]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

It is a real shame for agents trying to do the right thing by their cusomers to be severly penalized by the actions of those who only want to make a quick buck.

Agreed. I have yet to have a cancellation due to the verification call but my experience is limited to Pyramid. The other PFFS plans I have used did not require the call.

However, CMS rules may be put in place to protect the consumer, but they are way overboard. Perhaps if commissions were not obscene inviting agents looking only for quick buck things would be different. We don't have problems like this with Med Supps, IFP, etc.

I try to do a bit of fact finding before an appointment. I may show up with a recommendation of a supplement and then find the person wants an MA plan. CMS says I can't even speak with them unless I make another appointment. How the hell can we do a proper job for the client without being able to compare plans?

Rick

 

[Winter_123]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

While it is true that there are problems with some/many agents, it is also true that many seniors become confused again if someone on the phone approaches them with the "are you really, really, sure you want to do something like this" type of demeanor. You may have in fact walked them through a long and careful disclosure and evaluation. Keep in mind that many of the seniors who get cold feet after the "do you really, really" call do not have a med supp so they go back to original medicare. Who is going to call them up when they have a big unpaid bill sitting on their coffee table that would have been capped or shared as part of an MA plan? Where is the government and the $5.35 an hour telephone person then?

Winter

Let me play Devil's Advocate here, ladies and gentlemen.

For the past 20 years, the senior community has been ripped off, decieved, and robbed by the insurance industry, so much so that HCFA (CMS) has had to step in to babysit us.

This is why buying leads, hiring a telemarketer, etc., will only lead to situations like this. I think it is great that the companies are asking these questions. As someone who does not do the volume you folks do in the MA and MedSupp market, but keeps a 98% persistency rate, I am glad they have this safety net for my clients. In fact, I TELL THEM THAT THEY WILL BE RECEIVING A CALL, JUST TO MAKE SURE I HAVE NOT INADVERTANTLY OMITTED SOMETHING IMPORTANT. I also tell my Medicare clients and prospects that the person on the other end of the phone is not an insurance agent, and doesn't care whether or not I make a sale. Their only concern is that the plan they have is what you know you're getting into, and that you will not change your mind anytime soon.

Health, Life, DI, LTC all have free look periods. With Medicare Advantage Plans, this is their version of it.

To answer your question, not only am I not losing any business because of the verification calls, I actually have two people on Advantra Freedom, and several on the Universal Any, Any, Any plans who, because of the verification calls, knew what they were getting into, and have renewed their plans, with me as the Agent of Record.

Prepare your clients and prospects as to what they are in for, including all aspects of the verification call, and you will lose only that business that wasn't yours to begin with.

When the insurance industry stops abusing the senior market, then these hoops we have to go through will disappear. Yes, these people are rude. Wouldn't you be, if you had to read the same thing, over and over, for $5.35/hr? You have to understand, every verification call they take, if it is charged back, they have to take a hit, just as we do.

My heart does not go out to any of you who have lost business, due to the verification call. You did not prepare your prospect/client well enough, or else, you did not develop a strong enough relationship with those people. The very first thing I tell all my prospects/clients, with any type of Health-based insurance product is that they will not receive 100% of what they want - whether it be doctors, medications, etc., and that the best we can do is find the closest to perfect.

People take weeks or months to find the house they want to live in, yet we expect them to understand a new health plan in an hour, and stay with it for a year?

Would you buy a car, without taking a test drive?
Would you eat food that has not been regulated by the FDA?
Would you buy an electrical appliance that was not tested by UL?

Like I said, I don't buy leads, or hire telemarketers to get my MA leads. All mine come from informational meetings I conduct, referrals, and renewals. I don't do the volume you do, but I also don't worry about charge backs. In fact, one of my MA clients received a postcard for a Universal Any, Any, Any plan presentation from someone else, and invited me to go with him. At the end of the presentation, he turned to me and said, "You did a much better job."

These insurance companies are also, primarily doing it for their own salvation. Just ask WellCare how important the raid by the Feds was last year. Whether something was found or not, it is the hint of inpropriatety that lingers.

We are paying the price for the acts of those in our profession, who came before us.

Sorry, but...

 

[GreenSky]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

While it is true that there are problems with some/many agents, it is also true that many seniors become confused again if someone on the phone approaches them with the "are you really, really, sure you want to do something like this" type of demeanor. You may have in fact walked them through a long and careful disclosure and evaluation. Keep in mind that many of the seniors who get cold feet after the "do you really, really" call do not have a med supp so they go back to original medicare. Who is going to call them up when they have a big unpaid bill sitting on their coffee table that would have been capped or shared as part of an MA plan? Where is the government and the $5.35 an hour telephone person then?

Winter

It's an interesting point you make.

The bottom line is that all levels of government promote the "Nanny State." The only people who help others apparently work for the government. All others are solely in it for the buck. Just as a business ceases to exist when they no longer grow, politicians have the same belief in the governement. Where are the Barry Goldwater's when we need them?

While the following is off topic, I am convinced that as a nation we are doomed! The downfall of a capitalistic, democratic state is when the government gets too big. Fortunately, I'll likely be dead before the inevitable happens. But my son is screwed.

Rick

 

[MedSuppPro]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

For the past 20 years, the senior community has been ripped off, decieved, and robbed by the insurance industry, so much so that HCFA (CMS) has had to step in to babysit us.

Were do you get "For the past 20 years" from? This is simply untrue. I strongly disagree with your characterization of the insurance industry and that CMS has had to step in to babysit us.

Insurance companies have paid many a claim. Of course there has been rip offs and deceptions. But, by comparison the insurance industry has been the steady Edy of our troubled economic landscape, unlike our banking industry.

CMS got involved after the 1997 Balance Budget Act was signed by Clinton. Then we went through the Risk Plans and then the Medicare Choice Plans which replaced the Risk Plans because seniors didn't want to purchase a Risk Plan. Words do matter.

In 2001 the insurance carriers pulled out after funding and provider issues produced plans that in some cases where worse then the Original Medicare without a supplement. Then “rip off” agents and companies went out and picked up the pieces. We soothed the angry and deceived seniors. Many were more then eager to return. Then Bush pushed for the current 3rd attempt to introduce the managed care model to the "1965 Ford Mustang". Hardly 20 years ago.

Prior to 1997 we enjoyed virtually no CMS (Medicare) oversight. In 1988 the feds started the first prescription drug program that lasted less then 6 months due to a senior uprising. This brought about standardization of the MedSupp marketplace at the state level only. The states domain proved effective and most states did a fine job of taking care of their population. Most company and agent abuses went away. But, today we have a double layer of bureaucratic red tape. The Federal CMS program has told the states “hands off”. Many of the traditional MedSupp carriers could see the writing on the wall and have resisted the temptation to get directly involved in the Part C and D “robbery”.

The regulation of insurance has been and should be at the state (local) level. This has worked quite well for over 100 years and the feds should return the oversight back to the states. If we are really serious about cleaning up the MA marketing problems, then we should give the oversight back to the states. Ronald Reagan understood the importance of state rights. WWRRD

 

[fostever]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

While it is true that there are problems with some/many agents, it is also true that many seniors become confused again if someone on the phone approaches them with the "are you really, really, sure you want to do something like this" type of demeanor. You may have in fact walked them through a long and careful disclosure and evaluation. Keep in mind that many of the seniors who get cold feet after the "do you really, really" call do not have a med supp so they go back to original medicare. Who is going to call them up when they have a big unpaid bill sitting on their coffee table that would have been capped or shared as part of an MA plan? Where is the government and the $5.35 an hour telephone person then?

Winter

$5.35/hr! My MA plan's SSR dept. reps make about $42,000/year. During AEP &OEP they may have to work a Saturday or Sunday shift and that can make them testy, but for the most part they are well paid and happy.

 

[Bob_The_Insurance_Guy]

Re: Is anyone else out there losing Advantra Freedom MA clients during verification c

Bob:

Don't you ever worry about falling off your pedestal?

Rick

I don't stand on a pedestal. I just speak my mind about what I have experienced. There are two types of agents who sell Senior Products, those that are in it for the money, and those that are in it, because it has touched their family, and they try to limit it from affecting others.

To see me in action on my pedestal, why don't you come join me at the Job Seekers group I facilitate every Tuesday evening. There, but for the grace of God go I.

Of all the posts on this forum of which I DO NOT respond, it is because I am not an expert, or have any insight or expertise. The few that I do, I speak out about. This being one of them.

I'm sorry that some are offended about the oversight. But, we brought it upon ourselves. No one likes to be babysat, including me. That's why I don't play by their rules. I don't buy leads, hire a telemarketer, or conduct a seminar. I also take a lot longer with each individual as most others do, and if I even THOUGHT that there would be someone who would be confused during a verification call, I'd either refer them to someone else, get a family member involved, or just walk away from it.

I'm also sorry you feel that sharing my take on things is getting on a pedestal. Some things I am more passionate about than others.