Substandard Rating, Term vs Whole Life

soxfan132

New Member
6
Hello-- I'm 30 years old and currently single, but I have a strong hope of eventually starting a family and I've started to become extremely worried about how I'll ever be able to get affordable life insurance.

When it comes to me and insurance, there's good news and bad news-- the bad news is that I have some pretty nasty skeletons in my closet when it comes to health history, so if I were to apply for insurance I expect it would either be declined, or approved but with a substandard rating. The good news, though, is that I've worked hard and have a pretty successful career, so I think I'll probably be able to afford it.

Through my jobs I've had Group Life policies, upon leaving the companies I've found that the Group policies have usually been portable/convertible to Individual ones without having to prove insurability, so I've figured I should probably stock up on this coverage as much as possible. I just left a job this week, I have 30 days to decide whether to convert the Group policy to Individual, and with the new job that I'm about to start I've found out that the Group plan will also be convertible. The problem is that not all of it is portable to a Term plan; some of it is only convertible to Whole Life. Since the amount of insurance that I can convert from jobs will probably not be enough, I'll probably still have to apply for insurance at some point and prove insurability, and the decisions that I have to make now have begun to get me very confused about the details of Term vs. Whole.

My understanding is that Whole Life can be about 10x more expensive than Term, but that the premiums go into a "Cash Value" account that pays tax-free dividends. If as a result of being substandard the premiums for Term would go from about $1k/year normally to about $3k for me for the amount of face value that I'll probably want, would this imply that for Whole Life, the premiums would be $30k/year instead of $10k for the same face value, or does the 10x relationship change at all when one gets into the territory of substandard policies? Also for Term, if I don't prematurely die, my understanding is that the premiums paid are essentially just lost. For Whole Life, if I'm paying substantially higher premiums because of the bad health rating but it goes into cash value, would Whole Life therefore make more financial sense for me with a substandard rating since even though I'm paying much higher premiums, I get to (at least in some form) keep the extra money I'm paying since it's going into cash value? Or does the formula for the cash value calculation change so that if someone is substandard, they still get hit just as hard financially as they would if they had Term?

Thanks for your help
 
Permanent insurance = buying a home...you build equity with each payment.
Term insurance = renting your home. You won't own any of it.

You need to sit down with an experienced agent who can assist you in determining the amount of insurance you need and which type best suits your situation.
 
You need to find someone who can help assess the situation with your health history.

From there you will be able to work on a plan that fits your needs.

I would be happy to give you my opinion on it if you want. Message me if you are interested.
 
Here' the thing group policies normally have bad conversion options. You want to sit down with an experienced agent and find out your best options every carrier has a different appetite. I would say convert what you can now because it' your only bit at that Apple and after sitting with an agent and getting better coverage in place you could always drop the group conversion policies.
 
If your primary concern is protecting your family ... I would strongly suggest you reaching out to a term agent that focuses on placing policies with people with pre-existing conditions and see what they can get you within the term space. and see if you can afford term with that rating.

I love whole life and other permanent products but it's not necessarily a term replacement. For clients of mine that have a family and want permanent life .. I usually at the very least suggest they get term for a higher face amount while waiting for the cash value of the permanent policy to grow. One thing I will say about permanent.. is that it's more forgiving than term.. many permanent products allow you to "upgrade" to a standard rating if you're only slightly substandard.

If you have a health issue that is now controlled, you might work your way to a standard rating eventually... In that case ..if a level term seems to be too expensive.. look into a yearly renewable term .. that would be a lot cheaper initially .. but if the waiting period for your condition is 5 years ... you can switch to a level term at a standard rate.. but a lot of things have to go right .
 
Agree with the others. You need an agent. Tahoe Ray works in NY. He is great and understands both products very well. From a cash value accumulation standpoint, heavily rated products usually suffer big time in this area. Again, get an agent to help you.
 
Permanent insurance = buying a home...you build equity with each payment.
Term insurance = renting your home. You won't own any of it.

You need to sit down with an experienced agent who can assist you in determining the amount of insurance you need and which type best suits your situation.

You need to talk to more than one agent and get competing advice. There are VERY different viewpoints on what you should buy and how much you should buy, and you need to hear those opposing views to make your own informed decision. If you make a mistake, then your dependents will suffer from your mistake.
 
You need to talk to more than one agent and get competing advice. There are VERY different viewpoints on what you should buy and how much you should buy, and you need to hear those opposing views to make your own informed decision. If you make a mistake, then your dependents will suffer from your mistake.
In my opinion, it is more important to have the right face amount versus the type. Not one death benefit I have ever delivered did the check say it was term or permanent.
 
In my opinion, it is more important to have the right face amount versus the type. Not one death benefit I have ever delivered did the check say it was term or permanent.

I agree that the death benefit is paramount at claim time. The insured needs to die at the right time, while the policy is inforce.

20 or so years ago I wrote a good bit of term. Back then companies had better conversion options. I have converted my share. All the 20 - 30 year term plans are coming due, so are the plans the insureds had for those 20 years. Some no longer need or want any coverage. Awesome, the term did it's job. Many still need or want coverage. Oops!
 
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