What would national healthcare look like?

[rapidrobert]

It will look like this: a waiting list for important services; tons more money out of your income; even MORE inefficient administration (do you HONESTLY believe that the government runs programs more efficiently than the private sector?); in a word, it will look like ****.

"Democracy has failed evertime the populace realizes that it can vote itself money from the public coffers."

Oh, I'd like to add an appropriate icon- :bump::bump::bump::bump: a mass public humping of immeasurable proportions.

 

[J.R.]

What has to happen is there needs to be a third impartial party to oversee medical costs and necessity.

This 3rd entity would be known as the free market. The problem now is that people have grown accustomed to benefit rich plans for the last 30 years and "some" health care costs are increasing due to technology.

 

[rapidrobert]

Its also increasing due to the $1.2 BILLION dollars per year in insurance fraud- 60% of which is by health PROVIDERS!!!

 

[sman]

Its also increasing due to the $1.2 BILLION dollars per year in insurance fraud- 60% of which is by health PROVIDERS!!!

I'm not doubting the validity of that statement, but I would love to see some documentation on it.

 

[DenverINS]

How will we pay for it? We already pay more per capita for healthcare and still have 1 of 9 people without coverage. Cut out the middleman (agents) and cut out $100m CEOs and we wouldn't pay anything more than we already do but everyone would have coverage.

Private carriers spend about $.75 per dollar on actual healthcare, whereas medicare and VA are .$95. Thats all you need. Not great for agents but its good for the country.

Doom and gloom all you want but universal care is working all over the world. Compare our life expectancy and child mortality rates before anyone starts explaining the problems with the systems in other countries.

Sorry for the rant but one other interesting thing. Those crazy liberal Europeans and their high taxes outscore us when it comes to being happy.

 

[Winter_123]

We are most likely looking at national system that keeps health insurance and care in the private sector but is so heavily tinkered with that it walks and feels like the government in most instances.

Most likely scenario is a hyrbridized compromise between the libs and the conservatives. That would include nationwide guaranteed issue as the dems want along with a tax credit as the conservatives want. In addition, there would probably be some kind of state or national high risk pool or supplemental subsidy to provide incentives for providers to take the hard core cases and to keep them out of the regular guaranteed issue mix.

Along with that there will be lots of experimentation, pilot programs, demonstration projects, pork barrel programs etc in the name of pioneering efforts. Some parts of the provider system will be put out to the lowest bidder or will recieve subsidy from the feds to provide lower cost or better care. Competing providers may or may not be able to get in on this and may or may not be able to compete. This is already going on in the guaranteed issue states and it eliminates many, many carriers, shrinks profit margins and eliminates independent agents as they are not needed anymore. Just sign up online or at the government and carrier sponsored information session. There will be more efforts to do group bids and purchasing programs around drugs and other services too. Some carriers will be selected in and some selected out.

The chances of a single payor system are zero or less. The chances of ending out with a private sector program that walks and talks almost like a federal program are excellent and probable. Some providers will make a killing as contractors do off of any federal program but many will be cut out of the picture too or cannot compete. Many carriers will sign up for guaranteed issue but have no idea what the true costs will be without claims experience so the picture will sort itself out and change year after year.

The problem with the way the discussion has gone over the years here is that someone mentions national health care. Then there are dozens of posts about how a single payor system will never work and then everyone concludes therefore that it is all a crock and will blow over. That is a very binary and black and white way of looking at it. There are a hundred shades of intervention that are possible, and some of the tinkering is also deadly to the independent industry, and it is not going away, and it is here and is coming to your neighborhood soon even if McCain is elected.
If you live in a guaranteed issue state then one of the shoes has already dropped. Now, you are hoping to at least get a tax credit to help pay for the highest costs in the nation. And so it goes.... Big, big mistake to focus on just the discontent and problem of the uninsured. Most of the people supporting a national system of some sort are insured but are at or beyond the breaking point from paying premiums and other costs and they feel that a national system would be a source of financial relief to their household, regardless of what it does to the federal budget. Doesnt matter whether that thinking or is right or wrong. It is what is there and they have some candidates to go with it too.

Quite a few folks here have assured me that this is all wrong so I keep that in mind. The election is coming right up. Same folks also assure me that it will be a cake walk for McCain and that Obama does not have a chance. Stay tuned.

Winter

 

[fostever]

Really? And how do you explain the Democratic party and the 50% of the country (excuse me - of the voters) who vote for them? They SAY they want to raise taxes on the rich, but have you looked at what they consider rich?

When they raise taxes, it will be on just about all who actually pay taxes. Keep in mind, the bottom 50% of wage earners don't really pay any federal income tax. And it doesn't take much to be in the top 50%.

Unfortunately, we really have a large number of voters who are uneducated about what they are actually voting for or against. I hope we never have universal health care, but there is a ton of momentum in that direction. Even McCain is talking about doing something to help with the costs of health care. Granted, I don't consider him to be much of a Conservative, but he's the choice against Obama or Hillary.

Exactly, They aren't going to say tax the working poor or middle class only the upper-class. The staggering amount of debt already incured requires an across the board FICA increase and it isn't going to happen.

 

[DenverINS]

I think single payer universal would be best for the country but I agree its very unlikely.

I'm betting all we'll see is subsidizing for low income and guaranteed issue, neither of which is going to control cost. Very possible we'll see the subsidizing through tax credits. Its sad the only way our gov knows how to get something done is through the tax/rebate system.

 

[NewHealthStrategies]

Those crazy liberal Europeans and their high taxes outscore us when it comes to being happy.

Hard to imagine being happier than being in America!!!

But I guess it's fashionable these days to bash the US, what with our "most philanthropic nation in the history of the earth" status and all.

I'm trying to remember the last time I lamented over a bowl of bangers about how miserable I am here in the good ol' US of A... what with the most profitable corporations on the face of the earth (and the largest) and how down-trodden I am, because I'm supposed to "take care of myself" and "my government" doesn't do enough for me.....

..... C'mon....... let's hear it about how the CEO's of America are way too overpaid and we need to take the profits of the oil companies.......

"It always gets darkest right before it goes completely black!"

 

[padthaiforlunch]

How about underwriting being forced to take all ifp, just like they do in group?

The self-employed get to write off the cost of premiums. Extend it to everyone to take against their agi.

Or lower to age on Medicare to 21. We can pay for it with all the money saved when we leave Iraq.

Think of all the med supp and MA you could sell!