You Won't Believe Obama's Response

[houcoogster]

Obama must want a higher unemployment rate in the younger black communities. I thought he wanted it lowered but from his actions it will just increase it. Last I heard it was like 35% think about this... if there were no "minimum wage" would it be that high? If some of the safety nets were removed would it be that high? If the hix subsidies didn't exist would it be that high?

All of the Dem's programs only exacerbate the problem.

You're only worth what the market will bare, anything else just obscures, distorts and or destroys the market and accompanying jobs.

I am for a higher minimum wage = I am for higher unemployement

 

[unic.consulting]

Why do you feel a 'livable wage' should be legislated and not earned? You understand that if the lowest paid workers get bumped up, the bump will have to echo up the chain, right? You understand that raising the lowest wages just raises the poverty level, right? If what I am saying is not true, why not make the minimum wage $100 per hour? Then we all would have lots of money to spend!

I understand your rhetoric, and you realize just as well as I do the absurdities in the $100/hr argument. Which is why I stated that I wasn't even for an increase up to $10.10 as recommended by the president. But I do think that inflation has overtaken the current minimum wage, and a small increase is the correct course of action. However, I also stated that I feel the minimum living wage should be set by each state not the Feds. The cost of living here is much different than in Mississippi or Montana and I don't think a blanket increase is correct.

Good for her, but how many is 'many with advanced degrees'? I don't believe I have seen how many have dropped out to earn an 'advanced degree' as you claim. My wife is an online adjunct and virtually all schools are cutting positions due to low enrollment.

Here is a paper about the rate of increase

The non-parisan CBO would disagree with you....and they specialize in these things. What do you specialize in?

My specialty is mathematics. I have taken economics in college, but I admit I am not an expert. However, the non-partisan CBO also claims that the unemployment rate is going to go down.

 

[Quotebroker]

I understand your rhetoric, and you realize just as well as I do the absurdities in the $100/hr argument. Which is why I stated that I wasn't even for an increase up to $10.10 as recommended by the president. But I do think that inflation has overtaken the current minimum wage, and a small increase is the correct course of action. However, I also stated that I feel the minimum living wage should be set by each state not the Feds. The cost of living here is much different than in Mississippi or Montana and I don't think a blanket increase is correct.

What increase in value are the employers going to see for the extra investment?

 

[thebig_j]

At $10/hr min wage. Min wage jobs will be replaced my machines and no "low wage" people will be employed. Wal-mart has already replace a large number of employees with "self check out"

You think a McDonalds can be 100% automated. You think an automated Mcdonalds can't get you order faster, hotter, fresher. What does the customer loos out on, Friendly customer service? Do you get that with a fully human staffed Mcdonalds?

Big corp would love a reason to get rid of more of their low wage employees. What CEO wants to pay wages when you can keep it all for him/herself.

What about Us? The small business owners? Some of you are established and rolling in dough but what about us trying to carve our piece of the pie. Just making it work. If cost of living goes up due to a raise in min wage Small business owners could end up be the poorer than their lowest paid employee in their business.

The problem in this country is not to many low income folks. Its to much income disparity. The super poor working for the super rich. The super rich influencing policy to keep the super poor; super poor. The country as a whole didn't have to bad of a year last year. Record gains in the stock market. Manufacturers making BIG profits. But the only one's who get rewarded for big profits are the CEO's and Share holders. Not the people who's backs are broken to make those profits. IT IS ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS AND HAS TO STOP. It's not communism or socialism to say that a business should grow together. As the biz makes more money so should the employees. After-all it could not be done with out them.

What about this Idea, I will not say no one else has this idea but I have heard no one discussing it.

New National non-negotiable law.

No One employee (Or Owner) Can make more that 250 times the yearly salary of the lowest paid employee.

Its not perfect. But I think it's fair to say If you pay someone min wage (8.50 in IL) your (hourly) pay rate can only be $2125.00 Of course CEO's dont work hourly. So we can use a 40 Hr work week Times 52 weeks (min wage people dont get time off)

So Lowest paid (full Time worker)= 17,680
CEO makes no more than $4.42 Million

(Current MCD CEO made $13.8 Million total comp in 2013; his predecessor made $27.7)

?Horrible Idea?

Sorry for the long post, you all sparked a rant

 

[somarco]

Minimum (livable) wage is for unskilled, entry level workers and dummies. Most minimum wage earners are not worth more and if they are they will quickly rise above the minimum.

Why should anyone be limited in how much they can earn? If you want to talk about wage disparity, why does a rapper make more than a teacher?

 

[Norwayguy]

Honestly, it depends on where you live. Here in MA, a cheap 1-bedroom runs about $1k/month. Add in utilities and food and you're probably looking at around $18-20k/year. In Tucson, the average is $625/month. So $12k should be enough. A state-specific minimum wage would be great, but if the feds have to get involved, maybe deal with a national average at $16-18k?

The first question is should minimum wage be a living wage. Do low skill workers teenagers need a living wage? How much should a cashier at a grocery store be paid how complicated is a job where you roll a bar code over a scanner (don't forget this is so unskilled even customers are able to self check out).

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Minimum (livable) wage is for unskilled, entry level workers and dummies. Most minimum wage earners are not worth more and if they are they will quickly rise above the minimum.

X2.....I will never forget Harry Reid getting on the senate floor and saying he was just speaking with a woman who had worker her job for 10 years but had not gotten an increase because minimum wage had not increased. I fell on the floor you show me someone who has worked 1 job for 10 years with no increase and I will be seeing someone not worth what they are paid now.

 

[unic.consulting]

The first question is should minimum wage be a living wage. Do low skill workers teenagers need a living wage? How much should a cashier at a grocery store be paid how complicated is a job where you roll a bar code over a scanner (don't forget this is so unskilled even customers are able to self check out).

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Good question. I do believe that minimum wage should be a living wage. Teenagers usually do not work full time. If they do, they absolutely deserve to make a living wage. If they just want some spending cash, they can work one or two shifts a week. A cashier at a grocery store should also get a living wage. A living wage doesn't mean that they are going to move up in the world, but it does give them an opportunity to improve themselves because they don't have to work two or three jobs in order to just make ends meet.

X2.....I will never forget Harry Reid getting on the senate floor and saying he was just speaking with a woman who had worker her job for 10 years but had not gotten an increase because minimum wage had not increased. I fell on the floor you show me someone who has worked 1 job for 10 years with no increase and I will be seeing someone not worth what they are paid now.

I have no idea about the person Harry Reid was talking about, but I don't have much sympathy for that woman either. If I was working the same job - minimum wage or not - for ten years, I will have had a raise, or I would have been looking for a different job. In fact, that's one of the reasons I quit my last job before becoming a broker. I had worked for the company for 12 years, consistently received "exceeds expectations" on my reviews, had trained my entire district on a new computer system, and was offered $4/week for my raise. If I had simply "met expectations", I would have gotten nothing. Meanwhile, the CEO who "did not meet expectations" on his annual review got a $7M bonus. So, I packed my things and found a better situation.

 

[sshafran]

Everything is a system. Anarchy is the only way to remove all of them. It's simply a matter of defining which systems are worth implementing. My personal beliefs are based around the concept of "Do unto others". I know that there are people who will try to take advantage of me for that, but I am confident enough in my abilities that I'll own that slight risk.

Let's extrapolate that a bit...shall we?

This is always...and I mean always...targeted at the "upper class" or the "wealthy" and the argument is framed so that the Upper-income Class should do more for the lower-income class.

I would love to see someone apply this principle to the lower-income class. i.e., they should "do unto others" and:

• Strive to earn more to decrease the upper-income's tax burden
• Provide services to people who are paying their unemployment as a "thank you" for helping them during a hard time

etc.

i.e., we have a freedom inequality problem in America. What I mean by that is this: The unemployed and unmotivated 25 year old in my city has an incredible amount of freedom daily. He skateboards all day, every day. How does he eat? His mom gets foodstamps. He doesn't even try to work. Medical care? Free through OCare.

How is that freedom inequality? Well, compare that to the working class. They have freedom...but far less. It's freedom inequality, grossly in favor of the lazy.

I'd argue that laziness is easier now than it ever has been in the past. Laziness used to incur pain - i.e., lack of food, shelter, health insurance, etc. If we remove all of the pain, what is there to motivate us to work hard?

What will motivate my skateboarding friend to work? Nothing. He doesn't need to...because I'm paying for his livelihood. The pain from laziness is gone.

This is freedom inequality, and if justice swung both ways, he would need to do something for the employed as a "thank you" for his welfare.

 

[timsip]

I understand your rhetoric, and you realize just as well as I do the absurdities in the $100/hr argument. Which is why I stated that I wasn't even for an increase up to $10.10 as recommended by the president. But I do think that inflation has overtaken the current minimum wage, and a small increase is the correct course of action. However, I also stated that I feel the minimum living wage should be set by each state not the Feds. The cost of living here is much different than in Mississippi or Montana and I don't think a blanket increase is correct.

What rhetoric? If increasing a population segment's wage from $8 to $9, or $10 is reasonable, why is it not reasonable to raise the majority of the population's wage to $100?

Here is a paper about the rate of increase

You said 'advanced degree, did you not? Your paper shows enrollments in 2 and 4 year colleges. Let me help you a bit:

advanced degree
n.
A university degree, such as a master's or doctorate, that is higher than a bachelor's.

Your paper shows people going back to get nothing more than their BA/BS.

My specialty is mathematics. I have taken economics in college, but I admit I am not an expert. However, the non-partisan CBO also claims that the unemployment rate is going to go down.

Ahh, yes. How we report the splitting of hairs! From your article:

The CBO report found that Obamacare — through subsidizing health coverage – would reduce the amount of hours workers choose to work, to the equivalent of 2.5 million full-time workers over 10 years.

So either losing 2.5 million jobs or losing 2.5 million worker hours regardless of how you want to split it does nothing good for the economy. You don't get paid money to spend in our economy if you are losing 2.5 million worker hours, now are you?

But go ahead and continue championing Obamacare and it's wonderful effects on the economy.

 

[VolAgent]

Minimum wage, living wage, etc. are just the symptoms.

The real problem is the destruction of middle class jobs. And not just low-educated ones, but all middle class jobs. The computer wiped out millions of middle management jobs. Robots and cheap overseas labor did it to manufacturing jobs.

The sci-fi writers were right, the future is going to be a small group of haves and have nots, unless someone invents an industry that needs massive amounts of labor.

Arguing over whether or not people should be surviving on minimum wages jobs when college educated people can't find a job in their field is just silly. So far, technology has knocked down almost every industry. Service, medical and transportation are next. Pretty soon that won't be a Peterbilt passing you on the highway, but a Peterbilt powered and driven by Google. Your doctor will be in a cubicle somewhere and seeing 10 patients at once, all via tele-medicine. There will be a robot and a low paid CNA with you.